I understand why those who dismiss my suggestions about Bessler’s wheel, such as the importance of the number five, do so. I have never filled in the blanks convincingly and without a working model incorporating all of those interpreted ‘clues’, no words of mine are ever going to persuade people that I’m right,
Recently I began working on yet another design but still based on my interpretation of those infamous clues that I’ve ‘obsessed’ over for many years. My experience with this particular design has proved quite difficult because getting the pivots in the right place is only part of the problem. Getting the length of the levers involved and placing each one’s connecting pivot correctly was difficult, also it was necessary to restrict a portion of the arc of each lever as .it moved, in order to stop it locking at either end of each action. This reduced the effectiveness of the actions, but this limiting factor can be overcome by adjusting the pivot position and the length of each lever. Another problem occurs when adjoining levers clash during their action because they’re too close to each other. Again this can be overcome by using longer pivots which raise the lever in contention, or just bending them upwards to clear the offending one. This can solve an immediate problem but ultimately requires an improved layout to maintain actions.
So it’s a trial and error process, or rather a case of comparing several variations to discover which obtains the best result. I also I have to ensure that I don’t overt-tighten the fixed pivots to avoid slowing or limiting the free movements of the whole assembly. So I always loosen each locknut by about three-quarters of a turn from fully tightened. This tends to lead to some looseness of all parts but it’s better than having everything too tight.
In this particular case I have come to the conclusion that when Bessler said he awoke from an inspiring dream, but still had to work on it for a long time before he got it right, I can fully appreciate those difficulties. I still think it will prove almost impossible to build a successful working Besslerwheel without a fully hands-on approach, but I would be delighted if someone were to prove me wrong.
I work with a sketch pad, drawing ideas that I think Bessler is describing and trying to fit them into a coherent combination that might contain an overbalancing advantage but include a natural reversal mechanism, operated by the same parts which caused the initial action.
I know I always think I’ve finally got the answer, but that is an important part of the research. The optimism generated by the idea that I know the secret is a vital ingredient in wanting to carry on. The knowledge that Bessler succeeded and was determined to leave information about his wheel and my own certainty about the clues he left, is enough to maintainer my appetite for building new designs and keep my enthusiasm continuing.
When I moved house about four years ago, I threw so much stuff away, thinking it was of no use because it was all failed mechanisms. There were more than 20 assorted round wood blanks with hundreds of small perforations drilled for insertion of various pivots; a huge 8tangle of discarded levers of all shapes and sizes. Now I wish I’d kept some but they’re gone now, and of course I have a few new ones to modify.
One day my interpretations will lead to a successful wheel and I believe that, if not by me then by someone else using my interpretations of the clues. There are so many clues I have never mentioned because detailing them all would be too tedious and time consuming, and they need to be taken as whole, not little bits here and there.
JC
.
"Recently I began working on yet another design..."
ReplyDeleteEgads! Now you're up to BWA 3.0 (which stands for "Bessler Workaround 3.0"). Well, good luck with it, but it sounds like you're having the same basic problems you've had with the earlier versions.
Actually, I wasn't expecting to hear much from you here about any continuing pm wheel improvements for a good while after your mentioning in the last blog about all of the painting, scraping, and cleaning you were going to do to sell your current dwelling. I'd just move out and sell it "as is" and let the new owner worry about repairing and redecorating it. Did anyone repair and redecorate your current home before you moved in to it? No one did it for me and after I moved into my current residence I had to paint all of the rooms and their ceilings as well as replace most of the plumbing and electrical wiring myself which actually took over a year. On the bright side though, I learned a lot of new skills which have helped me in my pursuit of pm.
Fair comment anon 09:09. But four years ago we downsized to a bungalow, but we don’t like it. So we are going to buy a house again. This will probably happen next year so plenty of time to get this house ready and continue to complete my wheel/wheels, Deciding to move north coincides with other things.
ReplyDeleteJC
A single story shallow roof bungalow with outdoor veranda is what everyone wants when they "downsize" as they age. No more regular climbing and descending staircases to a second or third story common in a villa house or semi-detached which gets harder as we age. My hips and knees can vouch for the sanity and quality of life for making that decision. Painting and giving it a birthday may make it more attractive to a larger pool of potential buyers so that it sells quicker than the average days taken, but in a flat market may not get a substantial lift in sale price achieved for the cost and your time. Better to pay yourself for a full building report done by a qualified building surveyor available to all potential purchasers to give them some confidence that it has no major faults and is consented etc. - Phil & Kirsty
ReplyDeleteJC: "I threw so much stuff away...There were more than 20 assorted round wood blanks with hundreds of small perforations drilled for insertion of various pivots; a huge tangle of discarded levers of all shapes and sizes..."
ReplyDeleteOne would think that alone should have been more than sufficient to convince you that your pentagonal approach is not correct. If I was you, I would take another long look at those "...so many clues [you] have never mentioned..." and see if there is some alternative interpretation you can find for them. Wasn't it the great Einstein who gave the definition of insanity as "repeating the same thing over and over again expecting to get different results"? You may be doing exactly that and not even realizing it!
Indizio su MT 83 avete notato che il numero 8 é il simbolo dell'infinito, mentre in MT 86 il numero é normale .
ReplyDeleteYou wrote, “ A clue regarding MT 83: have you noticed that the number 8 is the infinity symbol, whereas in MT 86 the number is normal?”
DeleteSo, “ The infinity symbol (∞) was created in 1655 by the English mathematician John Wallis in his mathematical treatise De sectionibus conicis”.
I can’t see what you are seeing. It’s a nice idea but if Bessler wanted the infinity symbol visible he would need it on it side.
JC
John wrote "...if Bessler wanted the infinity symbol visible he would need it on it side."
DeleteNot necessarily. Bessler often hid numbers by rotating them in various ways as he did for the number 7 as was shown in John's July 17th blog. I do agree with anon 15:47 that the number 8 in MT83 could be an infinity symbol (after it was rotated into a vertical orientation to hide it) which fits in with the concept of perpetual motion that is supposed to be infinitely repeated motion. That number 8 can also be symbolic of Bessler's two direction wheels. The upper and lower parts of the number 8 are near perfect circles and they both touch an enlarged dot. The dot represents the cross section of the axle of a two way wheel and the circles each represent a cross section of one of its two inner one way wheels that were mounted next to each other and on the same axle which is symbolized by the two circles touching the dot between them. Brad even showed us how Bessler hid his lucky ratio value of 0.777 in the drawing number for MT83. I saved Brad's interesting drawing and here it is for those who haven't seen it yet or forgot about it:
https://i.postimg.cc/fb0kFDYy/bessler-s-mt-83-lucky-ratio-clue.jpg
Btw, I recommend that members and visitors to this blog download and save every drawing linked to here because you never know when you will have need of it like I just did. 🙂
I'm surprised that John didn't find that clue first with the two circles being two wheels on the same axle. It's so obvious...at least it is now that anon 21:24 explained it to us.
DeleteLol! If John didn't notice a pentagon shape or an eighteen degree angle somewhere in it, then he would have ignored it! 😆
Delete@anon 21:24
DeleteThanks for resurrecting that lucky ratio clue I found a while ago. I almost forgot I'd found it! I also agree with your interpretation about the infinity symbol and bidirectional wheel symbolism in MT 83.
Because of the many times that particular fraction of 0.777 shows up in Bessler's drawings, I have to assume that he deliberately wanted anyone trying to reverse engineer his invention to see it. It just could be some sort of "master clue" that one must take into account when trying to interpret Bessler's other hidden number clues. So far, SoS claims that lucky ratio is only the fraction formed by dividing the distance from an drum axle's center to one of its Y shaped lever's pivot by the radius of the drum. For both the Merseburg and Kassal wheels, that means that their lever pivots were all located exactly 56 inches from the center of their axles because 6 feet = 72 inches and 0.777 x 72 inches = 56 inches.
But, I think there could be much more to that ratio than just locating the lever pivots and I'm not just referring to the religious meaning of that string of 7's. It may be that you can get the lengths of the different coordinating ropes interconnecting the levers by multiplying other numbers Bessler hid in his drawings by 0.777.
This is a possibility that I continue to explore and will reveal what I find here when (if!) I get something that looks interesting.
Brad
Anon 21:24. I’ve studied the drawing and the interpretation is very clever, but if Bessler placed it in MT, for what purpose? It doesn’t help us to find the solution. MT was never published and as a learning aid for his potential apprentices, I suppose it could have provided a talking point?
DeleteThis drawing is more persuasive of the existence of the number 0.777 in Bessler’s documents than any of the others I’ve seen.
As far as I can tell neither Leibniz nor Newton ever used Wallis’s infinity symbol, although it was beginning to catch on the 17th century, so it’s possible that Bessler became aware of its potential as a infinity symbol.
Very interesting find guys.
JC
Brad your comment appeared after mine, but thank you for your inputs. I remain unconvinced of the relevance of the 0.777 number but I will try to keep an open mind.
DeleteMy apparent obsession with the pentagram does have a practical value which I’ll share with you one day soon, but the 0.777 number has only vague associations with angels etc and I cannot understand why some of you are latching onto the idea that it has any relevance to Bessler’s wheel.
JC
I’ve had another look at MT, and I’m just pointing out that every number 3 can be adapted easily to make the number 7. Also the number 8s vary a little and on balance I’d say it’s just a coincidence that the MT 83 could be an infinity symbol. I’m sure Bessler would have found a way to hint at rotating the image if he wanted to. In Wikipedia it described Wallis’s infinity symbol as taking ‘decades’ to come into popular use, so there’s no evidence that Bessler was even aware of it.
DeleteJC
I think that the serious Bessler pm wheel clue searcher would do well to read through that last May 8th blog because it is indeed loaded with new clues. For example we see there another clue that Brad found for us about that lucky 0.777 ratio in the Merseburg wheel drawing which you can see here:
Deletehttps://postimg.cc/HjNK5nMf
And that one even triggered SoS to find a similar "bonus" clue for us in the second drawing in DT of the Kassal wheel which is here:
https://i.postimg.cc/Z5ww4Ggr/the-bonus-clue.jpg
These two previously undiscovered clues show that there was something important about that ratio of 0.777 and that it clearly points to a particular location along the radius of one of his wheels. I go along with the belief that it's where Bessler placed his wheel's lever pivots. Exactly why there may however not be known for a while. But if we want to successfully duplicate Bessler's wheels then maybe we should follow his instructions? 🤔
I just can’t accept that ‘solution’ it’s too meaningless. I offered a better solution for the same picture, more detailed at https://johncollinsnews.blogspot.com/search?q=30+degree
DeleteJC
You do manage to make a pentagon inside of that left side DT drawing of the Weissenstein Castle wheel, but your placement of some of the lines to make it looks arbitrary to me (see my drawing below). Also you moving that big pendulum from the right side over to the left side of the drawing and rotating it around seems like it would not be an easy clue for Bessler to point out to prove his priority to some principle he used. I believe this priority verification clues were a lot simpler, but very cleverly hidden as was done with that MT83 ratio clue Brad found.
Deletehttps://i.postimg.cc/d3ZW8pzk/Untitled.jpg
The long red line must align with the upper short lever on the large triangle which means the precise point on the rim of the circle containing the pentagon is shown correctly.
DeleteThe other red line, lower left, aligns perfectly with the rope running from the pulley towards the window.
The circle containing the pentagram is not pertly drawn because I tried to do it with MS Paint on my laptop, but it’s good enough to understand.
JC
@JC
DeleteI can see how you got that pentagon in that Kassal wheel drawing. But, maybe it just happens by chance or maybe even Bessler did put it there on purpose. But, what does it tell us about the internal mechs in his wheels? Geometric shapes are nice to find and there are probably many different kinds that can be found in his drawings (weren't you finding triangles last blog?), but do they give us any information that we can use to start building or simming with? If not, then they are of very limited value, imo.
That’s because I haven’t published everything I’ve discovered. I’ve been sharing all the codes and clues I’ve discovered over many years, but I’m unwilling to reveal more until I’ve built a model according to the information I’ve acquired. It won’t bevlong now.
DeleteJC
1st part:
DeleteI have carefully studied the drawings provided by JC and the recent one by anon 15:17 and imo there can be little doubt that Bessler purposely arranged the parts in that second DT drawing of the Kassal wheel so that one could find a pentagon inscribed in it. He would have planned the drawing using pen and paper before he finally committed to engraved it onto a printing plate (in reverse).
Look at the number 2 on the axle and the 3 on the floor pulley on the left side of the drawing. They sum to 5 and suggest a five sided pentagon. Bessler knew, based on the radius of the drum, what the length of one side of a pentagon inscribed inside the rim of the drum would have to be and that the rope from the window down to the floor pulley would define that length. So he just adjusted the chord made by that section of rope to get that length by adjusting the distance between the window and the left drum's axle. Once that was done, he next had to adjust the placement of the right vertical frame of the left side drawing so that a line from the point on the rim near the number 3 to where the vertical frame hides the bottom part of the left side drum was also the same length. Finally, he had to get the remaining three sides of his pentagon and they had to all be the same lengths as the first sides he made.
Anon 15:17 was right when, in his drawing, he says that corner of the pentagon near the top of the left side drum could be placed anywhere. But, Bessler had to place it where he did to get the next third side of the pentagon (the upper left one) to have the same length as the first two sides he made. Then all that remained to be done was adjust the angle of that long red line that goes over to the center of the axle of the right side drum so that the angle it formed with that last third pentagon side he made was exactly 72°. That angle was carefully adjusted by moving the drum in the right side drawing a little to the left or to the right.
Hiding that pentagon in that DT drawing is a real tribute to Bessler's skill with geometry. But, one has to ask himself what relevance, if any, it has to his wheel's mechanics? It may have none and was just done because Bessler realized he could do it. Or, the shape of the pentagon had some special religious significance to him like maybe representing the five wounds on Jesus' body from his crucifixion which fits in with Bessler's extreme religiosity. From numerology the pentagon and the number 5 it represents can symbolize the five elements of earth, air, fire, water, and spirit. Putting it into his drawing might have been Bessler's way of saying that he understood all of the forces of nature as well as the spiritual realm. Also, the philosophy of Pythagoreanism that originated in Greece in the 6th century BC used the pentagram as a symbol of mutual recognition, well-being, and good deeds and charity. Bessler may have included it to appeal to any secret society types who found it in the DT drawing as JC managed to do.
Disciple of SoS
2nd part:
DeleteI don't think we will ever know exactly why Bessler hid that pentagon in that DT drawing unless we can find something he wrote that explains it and I doubt if that will ever happen. What really matters as far as duplicating his wheels is concerned is if that shape has anything to do with the actual mechanisms used inside of his wheels.
Right now I think that, other than JC, most here reject that possibility. As someone wrote, a wheel with only five mechanisms becomes bottom heavy every 72° of rotation and that tends to interfere with it keeping a steady torque as it rotates. Also, and most damaging for JC's theory, there is that description of the Kassal wheel making "about 8" thumps every rotation. If it had been "about 5" thumps every rotation, then I think JC would have a lot more believers in his pentagon theory than he currently has (which including him is only two if you count in "Shemp" who claims to be a reincarnated Stooge!).
So, to sum it up, I do not think that pentagon that JC found in that DT drawing was some sort of accident. Imo, it was put there on purpose because it had some special meaning for Bessler. Exactly what that meaning was we may never know. If it does refer to some sort of pentagonal arrangement of levers, then why did that sim done of such a wheel by that Sim guy last February not show even the slightest tendency to self rotate? Not quite the right design? Maybe. But, then again, maybe that failure shows any five mechanism design is also likely to fail.
Anyway, I do wish JC luck with his approach and I will continue to see if and how it changes over time. Right now someone said here earlier that JC was up to Bessler workaround 3.0 or BWA 3.0. I'm wondering how far along he will go until he either quits or dies off? BWA 5.0? BWA 7.0? BWA 10.0?...or he finds amazing success! I don't completely rule out that possibility, but so far things don't look too encouraging for that outcome.
Disciple of SoS
I can agree with your analysis, DoSoS. That pentagon John found was definitely put there by Bessler for someone to someday discoverer. But, what good is it if it had nothing to do with his pm wheel mechanics? If it doesn't, then I'd still like to know why he put it there but that may, as you point out, never be known. However, I tend to lean toward a religious reason. The pentagram serves as a reminder of Christ's suffering and the salvation offered through faith in him. In medieval times the pentagram symbolized truth and was used in Christian contexts before it became linked to occultism. These are all concepts that would have resonated with Bessler's beliefs.
DeleteI found this on a website called biblehub.com:
DeleteSymbolism of the Number Five
The number five appears in various contexts throughout the Bible and is often associated with God's grace. For example, the five books of the Torah (Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, and Deuteronomy) are foundational to the Jewish faith and are seen as a gift of divine instruction and grace. Additionally, the five loaves used by Jesus to feed the 5,000 (Matthew 14:17-21) symbolize God's provision and abundance.
Wasn't Bessler involved with some Jew rabbi? They probably spent a lot of time talking about the Torah and all kinds of Bible numbers and shapes.
@anon 08:12
DeleteI was looking for pentagon designs in the Kabbalah last night since I'm convinced that Bessler did study that book under the guidance of his rabbi friend. I found plenty of pentacles or five point stars, but no pentagons. Then I came across this talisman which is called "the Fourth Pentacle of Mercury" even though it contains no five point star: Part of the Kabbalah is a book called the "Key of Solomon" which contains talismans or magic symbols for all of the seven classic planets that are supposed to give a wearer of a particular symbol certain abilities or protections associated with that symbol. There are four different symbols for the planet Mercury and this is the fourth one of them.
https://i.postimg.cc/FKrWh9hg/fourth-pentacle-of-mercury.jpg
Notice how it looks identical to MT137 minus the Hebrew letters? Here's what its design is supposed to do for anyone who wears it:
"The Fourth Pentacle of Mercury is a talisman that confers understanding of all sciences and arts, grants knowledge of hidden things, and bestows the capacity to succeed in various occupations. It is designed to help the bearer seek out and penetrate into hidden knowledge."
"The Fourth Pentacle of Mercury is not just a decorative item; it serves as a powerful tool for those seeking deeper understanding and mastery over various disciplines. It is often used by scholars, scientists, and anyone engaged in the pursuit of wisdom."
Maybe MT137 is not the "Circle of Fifths" from music theory that JC thinks it is? Maybe it's really that Kabbalah talisman's symbol? Bessler could have purposely placed the Fourth Pentacle of Mercury just before the few drawings in MT that he eventually removed and destroyed which revealed the secret of his pm wheels. He did that in order to aid understanding of their mechanisms so students of MT would be better able to use those missing drawings to build their own pm wheels based on them.
Brad
Nice analysis, Brad. It makes sense to me. Bessler made that mt137 drawing and put it where he did in mt to sort of empower his future students at his planned christian school of crafts to be better able to understand the drawings that would follow which showed how his pm wheels worked. Why he left out the hebrew letters was probably because the school was for christians and many of them could have been antisemites who would not want to see anything jewish in their textbook. Also, Bessler did not want to make it look like his mt was based on the kaballah which was a book of jewish mysticism.
DeleteBut there is a major difference between Bessler's version of the fourth pentacle of mercury and the actual one with the hebrew letters on it. Here's Bessler's version
https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEhtiiAT1Kex2A8zSgBUCXe_7xAEkjZOWRahc290PS78n3wRu4i6Puig-T2eB5-Yb8KFZsKt4n-_YJ3R2hOxZeKEritdyqCpWYhnLifIBmtMpuDXuFalJ2_UhQ_MvKmoEcEQ-ZPUKlZLHLQw/s1600/MT+137.jpg
He added a big black circle in the center of the one from the kaballah. Imo, that black circle represents one of his big 12 feet diameter pm wheels. Their sides were covered with some sort of dark cloth to hide their insides from view. So Bessler putting the pm wheel symbol inside of that kaballah symbol was his way of trying to use magic power to help his students understand what was going on inside of his pm wheels. Despite being a devout christian, Bessler was also a believer in using occult powers just so long as they were based on some sort of jewish or christian religions.
Much thanks to Brad and anon 00:45 for coming up with something I thought I'd never see which is a logical explanation of MT137! It looks much different from the other MT drawings and the simple reason is that it has nothing to do with the arrangement of "perpetual motion structures" inside of Bessler's wheels. It's just a mysticism good luck symbol for those about to see those missing drawings in MT that we unfortunately will never see. I have the same feeling about all of those pentagons that John is finding. They don't really have anything to do with a wheel's inner workings but were hidden in Bessler's drawings for religious or secret knowledge reasons known only to him. But, the pentagon standing for the five wounds to Jesus seems the most likely reason to me because Bessler was obsessed with religion aside from perpetual motion. Didn't he try to start his own Christian Orffyrean religion because he was dissatisfied with all of the other Christian religions that he was finding in Saxony that he concluded were loaded with hypocrites? I wonder how many churches he was kicked out of before he finally decided they all had to be replaced with his version? Joseph Smith followed the same route before he finally started his own religion of Mormonism in the 1820's. 😇
DeleteAnother ingenious interpretation, but I think that your enthusiasm for seeking religious connotations are tending to subsume Bessler's real intentions to provide useful clues.which might aid in solving his wheel.
DeleteI do respect your work and on the subject of MT137 I confess there has always been one nagging doubt; the fact that MT137 differs a little from David Heinichen’ s Circle Fifths. I think maybe the evidence produced so far seems to show Bessler mixed solid clues with religious background information.
The facts are that Heinichen lived in the same village as Bessler at the same time. He was an accomplished musician and wrote organ music, at the same time Besslerband his brother were building organs, and he published a book detailing his ‘circle of Fifths’ theory of music.
JC
Hmm. It's a very difficult decision to deal with. Did Bessler draw up MT 137 because he wanted to teach his future students how to make notes on an organ powered by a pm wheel? Or did he draw it to use ancient magic to help them understand and build pm wheels? It's obvious to me that he was only trying to teach them some music! 🎵🎵🎵😉
DeleteI'm sure that when SoS finally shows up here and reads through these comments he will immediately suggest that we all start carrying that 4th pentacle of mercury talisman around with us! So let me help him in advance by giving you a link to a site where you can buy a nice ring with the symbol on it:
Deletehttps://www.etsy.com/listing/1348595419/fourth-pentacle-of-mercury-ring-pentacle
This ring is made of lead and nickel free pewter, but at the bottom of the page you can find a more expensive version in .925 sterling silver. For those on a budget you can also get it in the form of a coin for $4 that you can carry on you. When chasing after the secrets of Bessler's wheels, you will need all of the help you can get...at least Bessler thought so!
If Bessler recommended it that's good enough for me! I just ordered the sterling silver one in size 9. I intend to wear it when I'm in my shop working on my wheels. Thx anon 13:01 for letting us know where we can get this item.
DeleteI found another Etsy.com seller who has that Kabbalah talisman as a nice pendant on a 20" neck chain which some might prefer instead of wearing it on a ring. Rings I've found don't hold up too well when you wear them while working with shop tools (but you also have to be careful wearing any kind of loose chain or bracelet around power tools). He has it in various metals, but if you want it in 18kt gold, then it's going to be expensive!
Deletehttps://www.etsy.com/listing/804571766/fourth-pentacle-of-mercury-necklace-seal
His talismans are custom made in PRAGUE in the Czech Republic so expect about a month for an order to be delivered to you. Didn't Bessler hang around Prague at one time in his life?
Yes, anon 07:32, Bessler was in Prague around the year1700 where he befriended a rabbi and a Jesuit in that city. Apparently Bessler hoped he could somehow Christianize Jews and that may have been why he had a close relationship with both men.
DeleteWriting about the rabbi, Bessler said "...the Jew was a good Christian! He was a great exponent of the teachings of Nicodemus, and all in all I learned more with him in a short time than most people learn in many years."
Interestingly, the Jesuits were also trying to Christianize Prague's Jews about the same time that Bessler was there. They were not successful.
I don't think Bessler learned anything about pm from those two religious friends of his. He probably just learned some things about various religious matters from them. His interest in pm came from an experience he had in a monastery in Italy that he arrived at probably looking for a free meal while traveling. Such monasteries often offered travelers food and lodging free of charge for a few nights and even invited them to join their orders. In their kitchen he saw some sort of mechanical gadget turning a piece of meat over an open fire to roast it. He was fascinated by the machine which appeared to be self-powered, but was really powered by a falling weight or wound up spring and a gear system. He could not get that mechanism out of his mind, obsessed about it, and finally thought that it might be possible to make one that did not require winding up to make it run. What followed was him reading everything he could on mechanics and earlier attempts to build pm devices.
DeleteThen he began designing his own pm machines on paper and eventually trying to build some of them. After a decade of continued failure he was at his wit's end and probably becoming mentally ill from frustration. Then, incredibly, he found a design that could barely work, but was able to complete full revolutions from a stationary start. Many think it was some variation of mt13 that could keep its cog slightly out of balance by using some of its descending side falling weights to lift other ascending side weights all of which were attached to the arms of small levers. It was a miracle and being so religious Bessler immediately credited God with helping him. One will notice that much of his later writings about pm are actually praises to God for helping him.
Was he a hoaxer? Most definitely not! He had a real machine that worked and larger versions of it worked even better. Did he leave clues in his writing about how his wheels worked? Yes, they are there, but VERY carefully disguised so they will mean nothing to maybe 9,999 out of every 10,000 readers of Bessler's books. They are contained mostly in his precisely made drawings. Will you be able to find them? Most likely not! If they were that easy to find then others over the centuries would have found them already. If you seriously want to find them, then you need to study all of Bessler's writings and drawings for YEARS to have any hope of success. Think you are smart enough to do it in a mere week or two! Omg...Lol! If you are delusional enough to believe that, then you must also believe you could flap your arms and fly to the moon! 🌙🤣
Of course I don't expect you to believe me about this. You will have to learn the absolute truth of what I've written here for yourself the hard way just like tens of thousands before you did. But, who knows? Maybe you will be that extremely rare 1 in 10,000 Bessler pm wheel chasers that actually makes progress. There's only one way to find out. If your confidence is great enough (which it must be or you wouldn't have read this far!), then you know what you have to do. The very best of luck to you...and you will need a LOT of it! As for that 4th pentacle of mercury mentioned above...consider getting a dozen of the necklaces with it and wear them all around your neck at the same time as you study Bessler's drawings!
Sounds like a real fool's errand. But it's amazing how many fools there are in this world. 🤯
DeleteCount me in as one of those fools, anon 00:34, because I am convinced I can solve the Bessler wheel mystery, but just not in two weeks. Maybe in a year with enough luck. I do accept some of the many clues I've seen come out on these blogs. For example, I do accept that the lever pivots in Bessler's wheels were placed at 0.777 x the drum radius from the center of a wheel's axle. I also think that his big discovery came when he finally figured out a way to make MT 13 work. I saw many new clues in that last May 8th blog's comments which impressed me. Is the Ken B "Y" lever the actual one Bessler used? I don't know, but I'm impressed with that lever design because of how detailed it is. I don't think he just made up the details but based them on actual numerology clues he found in Bessler's drawings. I haven't read his book so I don't know exactly how he found those clues.
DeleteI think like most pm wheel chasers, Bessler started out with those rolling metal ball type wheels that were pursued by earlier pm chasers like Leonardo da Vinci. The idea is simple. Just arrange the tracks for the balls so that as they roll around inside of a turning wheel in such a way that their center of mass always stays at the same place on the wheel's descending side which will produce a steady torque on the wheel. It sounds so easy to do, but no one ever managed to do it and neither did Bessler. Then he started to explore designs with the weights attached to the ends of lever arms. That approach however only works if the levers are connected to each other in some unique way. Bessler, imo, found a way to properly connect the levers together and that is what turned MT 13 into a true runner. Five levers? Six? Eight? A dozen? Right now I go with an eight lever design. John Collins has so far not convinced me that the magic number of levers is only five. Maybe that will change in the future.
I'm going to give myself a year to finally solve the big Bessler pm wheel mystery. If I've gotten nowhere by next summer, then I'll call it quits and move on to some other obsession. We fools always need to be obsessed about something to feel like we can make some progress and better this tiresome world of ours.
@anon 02:57
DeleteNothing wrong with being a fool as long as every once in a while you look like a genius...even it's really only because you were an incredibly lucky fool for a while!
If you are not opposed to hydraulic type pm wheels (which I'm not convinced were what Bessler used), here's a quick design of one I made for you to consider. Those rolling metal ball type pm wheels are an impossibility because you are trying to find a design for one where the balls are constantly rolling downhill, but their center of gravity always stays fixed in space. Can't happen, imo. But with flowing water the situation may become doable. There was an Indian genius named Bhaskara II who designed a pm wheel that used mercury to create overbalance. My version could use mercury or just plain water which is safer and nontoxic. Bhaskara II was a 12th century AD math genius who actually stumbled upon the basic concepts of calculus long before they occurred to Newton and Leibniz! Here's an excellent Wikipedia article on him for those who are into history:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bh%C4%81skara_II
Anyway, I think he would have liked my version of his pm mercury wheels:
https://i.postimg.cc/hvHPz47Q/brad-s-water-wheel.jpg
I don't think this can be simmed with wm2d, but it might be with that algodoo physics simulator because I've seen sims made with it that have water splashing around in them. Unfortunately, I don't do sims so if there's any interest in the design, someone else is going to have to sim it.
Brad
Interesting design, Brad. If I get a chance later I'll do a quick graphical analysis of it to see where its cog is located. It's hard to tell just be looking at it. You mentioned that Indian guy Bhaskara II and it looks like he was THE world's leading mathematician in the 12th century. I found this illustration that is based on his description of his mercury powered pm wheel:
Deletehttps://mundooculto.es/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/ruea1.gif
However, I can't find anything that says he actually tried to build it. There have been modern attempts, but they all failed.
What's amazing about Bhaskara II is that almost 500 years before Newton he was saying that objects fall to Earth because of an invisible attractive force acting on them which we now call gravity. He also did other important things in math like being the first to use a decimal point to write fractions, introducing the concept of infinity, provided a simple proof of the Pythagorean theorem, etc. He was way ahead of his time.
And just for John here's one of Bhaskara II's pm wheels that only uses FIVE vials of liquid!
Deletehttps://duckduckgo.com/?q=bhaskara+pm+wheel+test&iar=videos&t=h_&iai=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DtHWs7jfZD6Q
Could the world's greatest 12th century mathematician be wrong about his mercury pm wheel working? Seems unlikely to me. Even if he never personally built it he must have done a lot of math on it before he proclaimed it to be a runner. Maybe modern versions of his wheels fail because they don't have enough of the mercury vials in them? I've never seen a modern one with more than 12 vials and I notice in that drawing that anon 10:26 linked to that is actually based on Bhaskara's description that it has 24 vials of mercury. Maybe those extra vials help smooth out the torque so there are no dead spots where there is no torque?
DeleteI found this interesting video by a guy named Praveen Mohan. He's Indian and decided to try building Bhaskara II's wheel using actual mercury to see if it works. He also claims that the designs for the wheel like the one anon 10:26 showed us above are NOT the design that Bhaskara II described! His wheel actually used curved glass tubes and not straight ones. Anyway, as Mohan shows in his video, using the curved tubes with mercury does not produce a runner. Here's a link to his video:
Deletehttps://youtu.be/KBxGdt9ev7M
Bhaskara-type r’s don’t work as we think they do!
DeleteThe model suggested by Brad remains in balance under Algodoo.
@Brad
DeleteSorry to be the bearer of bad news (which seems to be the only kind I deliver when dealing with pm devices), but I did do a graphical analysis of your design and it's not a runner. The cog of the water in the eight half tank chambers is located right under the center of the wheel's axle so there is no net torque to drive it. Here's my analysis:
https://i.postimg.cc/HxVWrqnZ/brad-water-wheel-analysis.jpg
Along with anon 21:14's comment this design doesn't look like it's worth building.😢
Thanks to those who took the time to analyze my version of the Bhaskara II pm wheel. Unfortunately, it's just another dead duck design from me which seems like the only kind I ever come up with. 🙁
DeleteAfter reading the above comments again, I was impressed by anon 00:45's theory that Bessler purposely left out the Hebrew letters when he used the Fourth Pentacle of Mercury to make MT137. He did that because he knew many of the future students who studied MT would be antisemitic and would not want to see anything connected to Jews in the book. Apparently Bessler placed that magical talisman just before the drawings in MT showing how his pm wheels worked in order to give his students some extra magical power to understand them.
As we all well know, after his arrest Bessler got really paranoid and removed and destroyed those few revealing MT pages which has caused centuries of frustration for those trying to duplicate his pm wheels. He must have felt guilty about doing something like that and as a substitute inserted the Toys Page. Many believe that all of the secrets of his pm wheels are actually deeply hidden in that single drawing and I also believe that.
One of the biggest mysteries of that page is the "missing hand" at the top. It was supposed to be holding one of the parts of the Jacob's Ladder toy on the right side of the drawing. Why did Bessler not complete that hand? Putting it in would have been an easy matter for him to do.
My new theory is that he left it out for the same reason that he left out the Hebrew letters in the Fourth Pentacle of Mercury he used for MT137. I again reviewed all of the many magical pentacles shown in the Book of Solomon and noticed that there is only one hand used and it appears in The Fourth Pentacle of the MOON (btw there are a total of 44 pentacles for the seven classical planets in that book). Here's an image of that pentacle:
https://i.postimg.cc/8PHnSWCr/4th-pentacle-of-the-moon.jpg
Even the direction that the extended index finger points is the same as it would have been for the missing hand in the Toys Page! So, my theory is that Bessler left the hand out because he realized that those familiar with the Book of Solomon from the Kabbalah would have recognized that hand as similar to the one shown in the Fourth Pentacle of the Moon and again that could have been interpreted as connecting MT to Jewish beliefs and would have been offensive to the antisemites among that book's intended audience. So that's the reason we see no hand in the Toys Page, imo.
Btw. According to one source online, the Fourth Pentacle of the Moon "is believed to protect the wearer from evil sorceries and any injury to the soul or body, while also helping to ward off evil spirits and harmful entities." This is also the kind of divine protection that Bessler, being so religious, would have wanted for his students.
Also the Jacob's Ladder toy that the missing hand would have touched in the Toys Page has some important religious symbolism of its own. It is "believed to represent the bridge between earth and heaven, mortal awareness, and divine intelligence". Perhaps Bessler used that particular toy to acknowledge that he got the secret of pm from a divine intelligence, God, up in heaven?
I think that Bessler had a specific reason for everything he put into MT's Toy Page. Finding those specific reasons won't be easy though. A serious Bessler researcher trying analyze just that one page's drawing could probably write an entire book about it!
Brad
@ Brad
Delete"The Jacob's Ladder toy... is "believed to represent the bridge between earth and heaven..."
That line caught my eye and it makes a lot of symbolic sense. The Jacob Ladder toy on MT's Toy Page could symbolize the connection between God in Heaven and Bessler down on Earth. The hand at the top, if it had been completed, would have represented God who, by working the toy, makes its tiles flip over one after another from the top down to the bottom of the ladder. That could stand for God sending the secret of pm down to Bessler on Earth. That spinning top at the bottom could represent the Earth which kind of spins like a top on its axis. The two hammer / axe men toys represent the secret mechanisms that make pm possible and are what God sent down to Bessler on Earth in the form of that energizing dream he had one night. At the top of the Jacob's Ladder we also see the letter Y and that could stand for the shape of the levers used in Bessler's pm wheels. After the tiles flip around from top to bottom of the ladder that letter Y will actually be upside down for a moment at the bottom of the toy. IOW God;s hand sent that lever shape down to Earth so that Bessler could find and use it! Maybe Bessler also saw it in his dream message from God?
If anyone here is a noob and has not yet seen the MT Toy Page, you can see it here:
https://orffyreuscodes.com/uf/80000_89999/82153/M/5edb624fd52a51210993db304e0bed22.jpg
Also here's a short video clip showing how a six section Jacob's Ladder toy works:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cWFBjZWrRdk
Noob 625
@ Noob 625
DeleteI found your analysis of that Jacob's ladder toy in the Toy Page to be spot on. It's the only toy shown that has a religious meaning. I looked it up and Jacob's ladder comes from Genesis 28:10-22 in the Old Testament. According to the story, Jacob was fleeing from his brother Esau and traveling from Beersheba to Haran when he stopped to take a rest. He fell asleep and had an odd dream (reminds me of Bessler's odd dream!) in which he saw a giant ladder or staircase extending from the ground right up into the sky to heaven. God was at the top and Jacob could see angels climbing up and down the long staircase or ladder between God and Earth. Jacob's experience transformed him, providing hope and a future for him despite his past deceitful actions. The meaning of the dream is that it is supposed to emphasize God's ongoing commitment to His chosen people. I think Bessler used the Jacob's ladder toy because of its religious symbolism and also to acknowledge God's major role in helping him find a working pm design.
Here's a medieval painting I found showing an artist's conception of Jacob's dream:
https://c7.alamy.com/comp/MTX442/jacobs-vision-of-a-ladder-to-heaven-1240s-or-50s-anonymous-424-morgan-bible-fl04-MTX442.jpg
After having his dream, Jacob awoke, realized the importance of his location, and called it Bethel which means "House of God" in Hebrew. He then set up the stone he had used as a pillow to be a pillar and poured oil on it, making a vow to God. You can see him doing that on the right side of the painting I linked to.
It's also interesting that Bessler shows the toy twice. One labeled B is a side view and the other labeled A is a full on view. I also noticed how the number 25 which is supposed to stand for the letter Y that some here are convinced was the shape of the levers Bessler used in his pm wheels shows up several in that Toys Page ladder toy.
Use the value of the letter B as 2 and put the 5 value of the Roman numeral V formed by the top two tiles together to get 25. You can even see a Y shape formed by the top three tiles in the B view. The view labeled A also contains the number 25 which you can get by adding up all of the little horizontal and vertical parts in it.
I also agree with Brad that there is a tremendous amount of information that Bessler packed into that Toys Page drawing and so far we've only found a small part of it.
anon 00:26 wrote "The view labeled A also contains the number 25 which you can get by adding up all of the little horizontal and vertical parts in it."
DeleteI counted up the vertical and horizontal pieces in that A view of the Jacob's Ladder and I get 26 and not 25 pieces. You must have miscounted them. However, I do agree with most everything else you wrote about. I'm not religious and was unfamiliar with the Jacob's ladder incident in the Bible. It's a fascinating story IF true. Knowing how religious Bessler was I'm wondering if he put that toy into the toy page because it was part of the dream he had that spurred him on to finally achieve pm? Maybe if it was, instead of angels going up and down a ladder, he saw weights ascending and descending around the axle of a wheel?
That old painting you showed looks like it came right out of one of those hand copied Bibles from the dark ages. That the descending angels are shown upside down suggests that they somehow can float in space and only used the ladder to pull themselves along kind of like human astronauts aboard the International Space Station when they move from one section to another in it!
Maybe the secret of Bessler's wheels is that as the weights invert going onto the wheel's descending side, they change shape so that their cogs move farther from the axle and then, as they invert again going onto the ascending side, they change back to their original shapes which moves their cogs back closer to the center of the axle? I'm not sure how that would be done and I'll have to leave it to the mechanical geniuses here to figure out. Maybe it was some sort of toggle type mechanism?
@anon 00:26
DeleteThanks for that link to the painting depicting the Jacob's ladder story from the Old Testament. Notice that the ladder being used by the angels to travel between heaven and earth has exactly 13 rungs in it? This further confirms that number is associated with God and heaven.
@anon 10:05
Your idea for a pm wheel has been tried in various forms...it does not work. Here's one version of it:
https://i.postimg.cc/fTjP7TJ7/sliding-weight-wheel.png
It's amazing how a pm wheel chaser can get so excited and actually hypnotized by a design that on paper looks like it absolutely must work. I've been there myself at times. I would find something that so convinced me it was a runner that I actually wanted to just immediately patent it without being bothered to waste time building it! It's a good thing that the US Patent Office requires a working model for inspection before granting a patent on any device claimed to be getting energy out of nothing. They save many a delusional pm machine inventor a lot of nonrefundable fees on patent applications that will only be rejected. There are however some foreign countries out there with far less strict requirements and they will grant a patent on anything including pm devices for a small fee.
DeleteJC wrote:
ReplyDelete"There are so many clues I have never mentioned...and my own certainty about the clues he left...the pentagram does have a practical value which I’ll share with you one day soon...I haven’t published everything I’ve discovered...but I’m unwilling to reveal more until..."
So he has MANY secret clues he's not sharing! Time to start begging him for some crumbs of information everyone. He loves to create an air of mystery about himself by dropping hints here about all of his secret clues that he will reveal "someday". Meanwhile his brand new bright shiny object continues to increase its glow. The brighter it glows, the more attention he gets. He just loves that.
It's all happening exactly as I predicted it would and right on schedule!
The Sage
Hey Sage...instead of trying to psychoanalyze JC all the time why don't you try contributing something here for a change that might actually add to our understanding of B's wheels? Maybe you can't do that because you are totally clueless when it comes to B's wheels? No wonder you are so obsessed with JC because he actually has some clues! 😠
DeleteThat sage might be a clueless troll, but I think he's been right about some things. JC spent years playing the "I've Got A Secret" game with everyone here. He'd show us an actual pentagon or two that he found in a Bessler drawing, hint about other clues that only he knew about and which were just too numerous to bother revealing, and then suggest how he was relentlessly closing in on Bessler's actual design. Earlier this year he was pressured into showing us his latest design which he only did after he finally convinced himself that it was useless. It turned out to just be another nonrunner to add to our pile of dead duck designs when an accurate sim made of it a few days later verified that the design was useless. However, that resulted in his last bright shiny object quickly dimming out. His aura of mystery was gone!
DeleteNow he's back playing the same game again! We're seeing pentagons again (and even some triangles this time!), getting hints about many secret clues that only he has, and then him telling us "but I’m unwilling to reveal more until I’ve built a model according to the information I’ve acquired." I think that unlike the big mistake he made revealing his previous useless design, he won't be revealing anything here in the future that could actually give anyone enough details to sim his latest design. That's because he will want to regularly dangle his newest bright shiny object in front of everyone's eyes in future updates and won't want to risk losing it again if someone makes a bad sim of his latest design like happened last time. So I don't really expect to see anything but vague hints from him in the future (however, I do hope I'm wrong about that). Like others here, I'll just have to wait and see what useful information, if any, he reveals in his future updates. 😐
Thanks for the enjoyable comments on historical devices,. I’m trying to finish my latest model, and as soon as I have, I’ll post the details - and then a series of my clue solving discoveries. As a matter of curiosity I’m going to measure the ratio between radius of my wheel and the main pivot points. As I will show you, there is a firm, easily measurable, clue available and should prove to everyone’s satisfaction whether or not 7.777 is real clue or not.
DeleteJC
No, John. That Bessler "lucky ratio" is exactly 0.777... and not 7.777. If your latest pentagonal wheel has a radius of 18 inches, then to meet the requirement of the lucky ratio, its lever pivots must ALL be exactly 0.777... x 18 inches = 14 inches away from the exact center of the wheel's axle. Many here think Bessler kept hiding this particular ratio value in his drawings because it is critical to successfully duplicating one of his wheels. If you do not use it in your wheel, then you may be setting it up for failure. 🫣
DeleteSorry anon 09:17, it was a typo! I’ll measure my drawing today and post what I find.
DeleteJC
To whomever finds the secrets of Bessler's wheels...this shall be your reward! Are you fully ready to receive it as Bessler was? 🫨
ReplyDeletehttps://i.postimg.cc/hGrz5KcB/your-treasure-awaits-you.png
YES! I'm 100% FULLY READY to receive my reward!!! There's only one slight problem...I'm also 100% clueless when it comes to how Bessler's wheels worked. I guess that means I'll have to wait a while before I get any reward...if ever...☹️
DeleteIf the wheel I'm now working on is a runner I will be moving into that vault!
DeleteWell I measured all the appropriate distances on my current model and none of them reflects the 0.777 number. To be honest I don’t care because I think the suggestion that Bessler embedded the number in his drawings, lacks any kind of convincing evidence. I’ve noted the claims but they are baseless in my opinion. They require extremely accurate measurements which doesn’t agree with Bessler’s comments about accuracy in the build. Plus my own build doesn’t require that kingdom of accuracy. The mere fact that my pivots require a small amount of looseness to operate cleanly, means the kind of accuracy demanded by the ‘lucky” number is impossible.
DeleteThere are additional reasons why measuring the distances suggested cannot support the 0.777 ration. I’m not going it into here but you can find one of my clues I shared in 2020 and previously at
https://johncollinsnews.blogspot.com/2020/06/the-merseburg-wheel-illustration.html
JC
JC: "...I don’t care because I think the suggestion that Bessler embedded the number in his drawings, lacks any kind of convincing evidence."
DeleteMe: Seeing that lucky ratio clue about a dozen times in Bessler's drawings so far was enough to convince many here that it's genuine and important!
JC: "...require extremely accurate measurements which doesn’t agree with Bessler’s comments about accuracy in the build."
Me: Bessler's quotes about accuracy refer to the slight variations in the masses of the lead weights he attached to his levers and not to the placement of pivots and lengths of lever connectedness principle cords/ropes. Those values would have to be fairly precise in order to maintain the small overbalance of his wheels. Variations in weight masses tend to cancel out when a wheel contains a lot of weights of slightly varying masses that are distributed throughout its drum.
If your current build does not place the lever pivots at 0.777 x radius away from the center of the wheel's axle, then many here will say it's not actually Bessler's design. It may and hopefully will work, but they won't accept it as Bessler's design. Also, are you using those special Y shaped levers? That is another major clue that is probably repeated more frequently than that lucky ratio clue. Bessler's drawings are filled with that letter's shape and its alphanumeric value of 25 which others here have repeatedly pointed out over the years. If your levers are not Y shaped, then many here will again say your wheel design is not the same as Bessler's design.
To me it looks like you are just trying random lever arrangements and lengths in your latest wheel and hoping one of them works to produce pm. All you seem to really have to guide you is a general idea that the lever pivots formed the corners of a pentagon around the axle of a wheel and some sort of scissor action being involved. Unfortunately, such trial and error building has been tried for centuries and achieved nothing. If I was you I'd start taking the many new clues being found by others here seriously. Unless you do, I fear that all you will achieve in the end is a lot of frustration, but no pm.
Also I think you put this comment of yours here in the wrong place. It should be up under your 09:46 comment. Comments down here are supposed to be about that realistic looking AI photo of the vault filled with gold bars.
Actually, I don't need a vault full of the gold bars to be happy. Three of them would pay my bills for the rest of my life! The gold bars in the US Fort Knox bullion depository weigh 400 troy ounces each. At a price of about $5000 USD per troy ounce, each bar is worth $2 MILLION USD and 500 of those bars are worth $1 BILLION USD! 🤑 The yearly interest on three bars worth $6 million USD would work out just fine for me. Converted into currently and invested into a mutual fund that delivers 6% per year in dividends, they would provide me with $360,000 USD per year. That's a medical doctor's salary and all I have to do is just sit back, relax, and collect it. If they give me my three gold bars then they can keep my folder marked "All of the Secrets of Perpetual Motion" and I'll wish them the best of luck with it.
Thank you anon 08:37, for your opinions. Obviously I disagree. Those ‘Y’ shaped lever are a figment of Ken B’s fevered imagination and have no place in Bessler’s wheel. Just as the so-called lucky numbers are also irrelevant
DeleteI’m not trying random lever lengths at all, everything I test goes according to Bessler’s clues. It’s amazing to me that despite the heavy emphasis on the number 5, the geometry and numerous other items also emphasise the importance of the number 5, (also 7 and nine) illuminating text, none of you seem able to ask the questions - (how and why?) - in his name in his pseudonym, his geometry clues, his chronograms, his alphanumerics, his numerous hints …….. all abandoned for the sake of a set of imaginary clues. Nothing substantial like Bessler’s clues, simple to understand and repeated in different places.
JC
I wish people here would stop trying to help JC to achieve pm with designs that don't use his various pentagon type clues. You are all wasting your time. Imo, he is no longer capable of any sort of rational discussion on this subject. He is totally obsessed with his approach and you all just have to accept that.
DeleteIt's obvious to me that he, like most pm chasers, is one of those persons who has to learn his lessons in life the hard way. I was there myself years ago and had reached the point where I no longer trusted anyone else's opinions but my own. I was so filled with confidence about certain matters, like pm, that I had actually become unreachable and unteachable. There was a kind of high connected with it that I actually enjoyed. Everyone else was saying "A" and I was the only one saying "not A"! It made me feel special and got me a lot of (negative!) attention. I was special. I was a "contrarian" and proud of it!
Then the day of my big crash finally came and it was not pleasant. I finally realized that other people also have a lot of valid answers that I did not have and in fact to which I had become blind. It was a big awakening for me and a bitter pill to swallow. Admitting one has been wrong for a long time is probably one of the most difficult things in life for a person to do.
So let JC be JC and do his thing. If he does not have Bessler's design then our harsh and uncaring universe will eventually catch up with him and point out his error to him.. And then we can expect to see him excessively apologizing for not having looked at all of those other clues people have been finding all along that point away from his pentagonal approach. Just give him his space and let nature take its course.
He won't be the first person this happens to nor the last. He'll just be another guy who was struggling to find a solution to Bessler's pm wheels and was looking in the wrong direction like many thousands before him did. 😌
Lovely comments, thank you. Of course I’m not so sad that I wouldn’t recognise a true solution even if it omitted the pentagon etc. but I would be intrigued to know how it was done. But I shall continue to use what I believe is the answer, until then.
DeleteJC
@anon 15:34
DeleteSadly the pm world is glutted with people all looking in the wrong directions. But, at least they are looking somewhere whereas the average person could not care less to look anywhere at all for pm. He is content to just know that his room light comes on when he flips the wall switch for it.
I liken our present situation to a room full of immortal screeching monkeys all pounding away on typewriters provided with an endless supply of paper and ink ribbons. Given enough time, one of those monkeys will finally type out one of Shakespeare's plays that will be an exact copy word for word. Eventually, one of the world's Bessler pm wheel chasers will also find out how he did it so copies can be made. The question I have is will any us still be living when that day finally arrives? Probably not.
Even more discouraging is when I ask AI to solve the mystery and all it does is regurgitate the official line that pm is impossible and that Bessler was a hoaxer. When I ask it how Bessler hoaxed his wheels it says that he was a clockmaker and used concealed springs in it somehow. In other words, since the first law of thermodynamics can NEVER be violated, therefore Bessler's wheels (and any other pm machines) MUST have been hoaxed. No exceptions allowed. Class dismissed!
Sad, but true. It’s upto us stalwarts.
DeleteJC
JC wrote "There are so many clues I have never mentioned because detailing them all would be too tedious and time consuming, and they need to be taken as whole, not little bits here and there."
DeleteI noticed that he has no problem putting down other peoples' revealed clues here by dismissing them as "baseless", "imaginary", and "irrelevant" while making endless excuses as to why HE cannot reveal any of his own clues here? Imo, the real reason he does not reveal them is because he knows that they could be similarly labeled by others and he wants to avoid that kind of treatment as long as possible. He might think his tactic is fooling people around here, but it is not. The smarter members here don't pay attention to his words, but rather to his actions or actually to his lack of them. Not revealing his "never before seen clues" will do nothing to help find a solution to Bessler's wheels. It's main purpose is to protect his ego and as the Sage said help him maintain an air of mystery about himself.
You know what? I could close this blog right now and not lose any sleep over my decision. I’ve been here many times over the years but I always stay on in the hope that someone will one day find the solution to Bessler’s wheel.
DeleteBut the nasty comments from the trolls just makes me all the more determined to keep going - but without the comment feature. The trolls are a nuisance and are clearly written by people suffering from a mental illness, but I do appreciate the sensible or critical or supportive comments and I’m loath to do that again, but I will if I have to, or I could insist on people signing in, but that defeats the ease with which people can comment and removes the comradely feel to it.
JC
I'm not sure if I'd call them trolls just because they criticize you. Other than "The Sage", most of them seem like regulars here who are just frustrated with your secrecy and posturing about knowing how Bessler's wheels worked. There is a big difference between truly knowing something and just believing it. However, I think you did make a little progress in this blog. At least you now have people agreeing with you that Bessler did deliberately put a pentagon into that DT drawing. Unfortunately, it seems like most still don't think it has anything to do with Bessler's pm wheel mechanics. It's up to you to provide extra convincing evidence to support your belief that it does. Providing an occasional photo or drawing of what you are trying to do instead of just vague written descriptions would be a big help and could recruit people to try to help you finally get a runner. Of course, I suspect no matter what you do you will always be fighting against that 1721 "...can be heard the sound of about eight weights..." clue by Joseph Fischer which I believe is the main one that keeps people from supporting your pentagon theory.
Delete@ anon 1920.
DeleteThat quote from Fischer's letter is a real deal killer for me believing Bessler only used five weights in his wheels. John has tried to explain it away several times in the past but was never very convincing imo. Then John started saying it wasn't five weights but maybe seven or nine that somehow averaged out to making eight sounds when Fischer made his measurement.
I wish we knew the exact number of weights that Bessler removed from the Merseburg wheel when it was moved to a new set of nearby vertical supports. If we had that exact number and all of the weights were removed, then we could see if the total was a multiple of 5 or 7 or 9 or, as most here believe, 8 weights. All we know is that the weighs filled a fairly large box. I'm imagining a small wooden chest with thick walls maybe 1.0" x 1.0" x 1.5" in size with handles on its sides that could be held by one person. But if it contained four pound lead cylindrical weights packed together at the bottom to a depth of six inches, then it would have weighed hundreds of pounds and have needed two men to lift and move.
Unfortunately, there is so much information we do not have about his wheels and are forced to try to extract it from the various numerology and geometry clues that Bessler definitely put into his drawings. That is a very tedious job and easily distorted by our own preconceptions and biases. If only Bessler's enemies had not had him arrested and made him paranoid and vengeful, then he might have left those missing drawings in his unpublished MT and we would all finally know his pm wheels' secret mechanics today with certainty... 😞
I don't think your estimate made by knowing the total number of 4 lb weights removed would be that easy to make. Most likely the Merseburg wheel contained two side by side one way wheels and, assuming that each had 8 levers for a total of 16 levers, then who knows how many of the levers were active during a single wheel rotation.
DeleteIf one accepts the KenB versions of Bessler's 12 foot wheels (I do), then each one of them contained two back to back one way wheels each of which had eight levers with three lead cylinder weights attached to the ends of one of the arms of a Y shaped lever. Do the math and you get a total of 2 one way wheels x 8 levers/wheel x 3 weights/lever = 48 weights.
DeleteHe agrees that the weights in the Merseburg wheel were 4 lbs each (which we all accept), but that the weights in the Kassal wheel were doubled to 8 lbs each. Apparently, Bessler did that to impress Count Karl with a wheel that would be twice a powerful as the Merseburg wheel had been.
More math for the Merseburg wheel. 48 lead weights at 4 lbs each works out to 192 lbs. If a wooden box Bessler hid them in weighed 30 lbs that's a total weight for the loaded box of 222 lbs. If two men each grabbed a strongly attached handle on one side of the box, they would each have to lift 111 lbs which could certainly be done if they were in shape and the box when filled only had to be moved a short distance (during the demonstration it probably did not need to be moved at all and was mainly there so no witnesses could accurately count how many weights were in the Merseburg wheel).
I did some math once to find out how big a lead cylinder 4 inches long and weighing 4 lbs would be. I was surprised to see that it was small and about the size of a small juice can and could be easily held in one hand.
Bessler wrapped a few of those weights in handkerchiefs and passed them around to witnesses of the Merseburg wheel demonstration. They were instructed not to touch the ends of the cylinders. Most likely Bessler had bored long, small diameter holes through the entire length of each cylinder weight whose openings at the ends he did not the witnesses to feel. KenB thinks that each weight was held between two arms of a lightweight wooden lever by a long smooth bolt which could be quickly loosened so that the weight could be removed from the lever.
48 weights is a lot to have to have removed to lighten the Merseburg wheel enough so its axle could be moved to new supports. If Bessler from practice only needed 30 seconds to remove a weight and then another 30 seconds to reinstall it, the witnesses would have had to wait 48 minutes until the demonstration could continue. Karl's servants may have entertained them with music and wine during that time while the mathematicians and engineers discussed what they were seeing and how Bessler's wheels could be used.
I’ve lost count of the number of clues I’ve provided, all interpreted to the best of my ability, many going back years on this blog, and also on several websites. I can’t force you to believe in the pentagram and the fact that as well as five mechanisms, seven or nine will also work.
DeleteI can only post my information and hope that one day someone will put it altogether and produce a working Besslerwheel.
JC
@JC It looks to me like people here want to see all of your never before revealed clues. Maybe if you reveal the most convincing of them they will make a better case for your 5 or 7 or 9 weight wheel? Also the more drawings or photos you can show the better. Maybe the real cause of people's rejection of your approach all along has been YOUR secrecy? Mysteries do not inform...they only lead to frustration and then anger and revenge in the form of rejection. Eliminate the mystery and you may eliminate the rejection.
DeleteI asked an AI program to scan all of the existing online info about Johann Bessler's life and then generate for me an image that shows what he may have seen in that invigorating dream he had that motivated him to continue in a certain direction that eventually led to him finding his runner. Here is what AI thinks that dream may have looked like!
ReplyDeletehttps://i.postimg.cc/MHK7GL9S/Bessler-s-Invigorating-Dream.png
The Latin above the wheel translates to "The Power Inherent in Nature Never Fails".
I had the exact same dream last night!!
DeleteOnly kidding. 😄 Actually Bessler's dream may have been similar to that AI version. I can imagine him dozing off late one night on a table covered with drawings of various pm wheel designs and dreaming about a wheel loaded with shiftable weights. Suddenly two angels fly into the scene and begin moving the weights around on the wheel's descending and ascending sides to create a persistent imbalance and rotation. They show him how the weights in his wheel must be interconnected to produce the correct shifting motions in them as they are carried to various locations around the wheel. Then the phrase "Gravitas est mihi amica" appears and in English it means "Gravity is my friend". It certainly wasn't when it finally killed Bessler though! But, maybe in the dream it was a blessing from one of the angels or from God that gravity would cooperate with Bessler to make it easier for him to find a working pm design? Was it all just a dream...or an actual message from God! I doubt if anyone could have convinced Bessler that is was "just a dream". He was way too religious to dismiss it like that.
Damn...this would all make a great movie. Where is our movie?
So that's why my wheels aren't working! I've been leaving out the critical components...ANGELS! I would have to be an atheist!
DeleteAn atheist believes in Angles !
DeleteI have no regerts !
Delete