Sunday, 8 July 2018

Challenging the Belief that it is Not Possible to Obtain Energy from Gravity

In my last post I commented that gravity might not be an energy source, just as we have been taught and continue to be so - but many years ago I came to the conclusion that this must be wrong.  My reasons for this are briefly discussed below.
If we believe (as I do) that Bessler told the truth then his implication that gravity provided the sole means of energy for his wheel means that gravity can be used as the ultimate source of energy for the wheel, even though we have been taught that this is impossible.  Please read on for my explanation.

The many tests and demonstrations the wheel underwent, all indicate that what Bessler said was true, and since he did not dare to cheat because being found cheating could lead to execution by the axeman, we have to accept his assurances.  In support of this we have the word of a knowledgeable man, Karl the Landgrave of Hesse-Kassel, known for his absolute integrity, that the machine was genuine because he had studied the interior.

Dismissing these points means that it is unlikely that anyone will ever find the solution to Bessler's wheel, despite the fact that we know it worked.

Apologies for briefly going back to basics.  In the case of a conservative force the total work done in moving a particle between two points is independent of the taken path. When an object moves from one location to another, the force changes the potential energy of the object by an amount that does not depend on the path taken.

In other words, in the case of gravity, if something is dropped it loses the potential energy it had at a higher point.  But we can restore it by lifting the object dropped, back up to its higher point

In the case of a non-conservative force the energy that it removes from the system is no longer available to the system for kinetic energy.

So our problem lies in finding a way to lift the fallen weight back up without using any additional forces other than gravity.

This is said to be impossible because the energy expended in dropping the weight has to be found in order to lift it back up again, but the energy has already been spent so there is no way to use gravity to lift it back up again - even though gravity is a continuous force, and a non-conservaive force could not drive a wheel of continuous rotation. Therefore it has to be a conservative force driving Bessler's wheel.

I have suggested the following argument countless times and people still don't get it.  The interface between gravity and Bessler's wheel is the weights.  Gravity makes the weights fall, and the weights make the wheel turn.

Interfaces play a major part in all types of motion. Wind and sails, steam and piston, flowing water and waterwheels, etc.  In each case an energy source provides the impetus and the interfaces react to provide motion.  So it is with gravity, it provides the force and the weights react to it.

Returning to my point about Bessler's wheel and not looking for an additional source of energy, everyone has been looking for this mysterious energy source that has been  suggested, for many years.  They have been unsuccessful because no such other source exists and neither is it necessary.  Steam, ambient temperature changes, bellows, live animals have all been suggested but nothing has been able demonstrate a similar power output which Bessler's wheel did relying purely on gravity

Therefore we must assume  that there was no other force used, and that leads us to the only possioble conclusion, Bessler found a way to use gravity alone to drive his machine, and that leads us to the final conclusion and it is this;

There is a way to configure the weights so that they respond to the effect of gravity by creating an permanent excess weight on the downwards side of the axle.  In confirmation of this, even when the wheel is stopped the overbalancing effect is still in operation and only the brake prevents the wheel from turning.  This overbalancing is produced automatically as soon as either a weight falls, or a weight has already fallen.  No other scenario can explain this feature of the wheel.

We can calculate the work done by gravity in making a weight fall by multiplying the mass of the weight times the distance it falls vertically, so at least we are allowed to assume gravity does do work!  The assumption that we cannot use gravity as an energy source relies totally on empiricism, a definition of which is, 'by means of observation or experience rather than theory or pure logic,'   In other words the conclusion that gravity cannot be an energy source relies not so much on theory and logic as by observation.  In other words no one has even been able to configure the weights to make wheel rotate continuously therefore it must be impossible.

If you are still reluctant to accept the premise that gravity is a source of energy consider the following. British clockmaker William Clement produced the first longcase clocks around 1680. It could run for a week without having the weights raised to restart the clock.  That's a week of gravity power.  But now consider this.

The Clock of the Long Now, also called the 10,000-year clock, is a mechanical clock under construction, that is designed to keep time for 10,000 years. The project to build it is part of the Long Now Foundation.


The project was conceived by Danny Hillis in 1986. The first prototype of the clock began working on December 31, 1999, just in time to display the transition to the year 2000. At midnight on New Year's Eve, the date indicator changed from 01999 to 02000, and the chime struck twice. The two-meter prototype is on display at the Science Museum in London.

As of June 2018 , two more recent prototypes are on display at The Long Now Museum & Store at Fort Mason Center in San Francisco.

The manufacture and site construction of the first full-scale prototype clock is being funded by Jeff Bezos' Bezos Expeditions, founder of Amazon, with $42 million, and is on land which Bezos owns in Texas.

A clock designed to run for 10,000 years purely on the force of gravity.  Do you still think gravity is not a source of energy?

JC

89 comments:

  1. Hi John Collins!! Sure, water wheels run all day and all night on gravity. like Hoover dam for instance. There are four high voltage transmission lines coming into California. I think each one is equal to about 1,000 H.P.
    Anyway, Bessler's wheel must have run on gravity, for the simple fact they could self start from a standing start. Plus the first two wheels had to be restrained to prevent them from turning. Also the smaller wheels turned faster than the larger wheels which is an indication that they used gravity. Finally, the rim speed of the last wheel turned very close to the velocity due to the acceleration of gravity, which was about 15 feet per sec. As you know a weight, starting from rest will fall 16 feet in one sec. Again, this would indicate that the wheels were powered by gravity. Sam

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    1. An indication, Sam? That is circumstantial evidence. My thoughts exactly.

      Marinus.

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    2. Right, proof really, Sam

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  2. John,

    You are absolutely right. But tell that to a scientist and he will laugh. Tell the same scientist that gravity drives the Universe and he will agree. Unfortunately, sometimes words alone are not enough.
    Great blog, success with your build.

    Marinus.

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    1. Again you are right, only the experiment is meaningful, Sam

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  3. Follow up: My latest theory is; a compound lever(s) was used to lift the weights back up. But I've built a hundred wheels, so this idea could be wrong too. In other words, the difference, or ability in lifting a falling weight back up is the mechanical advantage, (MA) of the levers. If you get what I mean, Sam

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    1. Sam...In a true Bessler wheel, the weights don't have to be actually lifted by the levers...

      The design is such that the lifting takes place automatically...

      Yellow... It is not a big issue if the translation is correct... But the statement is true... That's how the wheel works...

      As long as the weights maintain their mass and position their movement is guaranteed...

      Gravity's impetous is necessary but the subsequent role of inertia, CP, CF, angular momentum is crucial to the wheel's unceasing motion...

      The wheel design is such that you can't say that only gravity is totally responsible for the entire act...

      If it was so then it wouldn't have taken this long...

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    2. Suresh, It's the unknown; you can say any thing you want to, and you could be right---------------------Sam

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    3. Sam... You could also refuse to accept everything I say... But, you keep forgetting to realize my claims... Why should I fool myself and everyone else by giving false information?... What exactly I stand to gain this way?...

      It pains to see you guys going off track often...rightly understanding BW is not in everyone's understanding... The right thing for anyone to do is to debate on it rather than dismiss like this... Why don't you prove me wrong?...

      You won't know how hard I had to work to learn the inner workings of BW... Have you observed anyone to sound so confident like me?...

      I repeat, the weights in Bessler Wheel don't have to be lifted by the levers... It's an automatic happening... This is the biggest mystery... Not everyone can really understand it... That's why they find it easy to brush my claims...

      The idea is so simple but quite difficult to hit upon... If you can work out how the weights fly up you will have the BW riddle solved... It is as simple as that... But people prefer otherwise...

      You know you have got to trick the gravity here... To make it aid the lifting... It is that trick that Bessler employed... It is that trick that Karl gazed upon and wondered in amazement... It is that trick that is so simple and yet quite evasive to everyone... It is that trick that can change the whole game... It is that trick that took bessler also so many years to comprehend... And, it is that very trick which is also described by Bessler as a major clue...

      Do you still think Sam that I would ever misguide you... Never...

      You will know how much right I have always been later when I reveal all... Be different Sam... Don't dismiss all that I say... You will certainly not find another me...

      Good Day...



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  4. "Special trials have demonstrated for eyewitnesses that this mechanical wheel is a self-rotating system of several heavy bodies and will be as long as the bodies remain heavy and the universe exists."

    This is a passage from Der Triumphirende. If this translation is true, it looks like he only used gravity.

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    1. John, can you confirm if the above comment from Der Tri is correctly translated?
      I have some doubts about this translation.

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    2. I don't know any German, yellow, so I can't advise you on the correctedness of the translation. If the above was taken from my version of DT then I would say it is correct. My translator had a degree in 18th C German and I trust his work.You can always take the original German and run it through a translator such as google or rnay of the other free translators..

      JC

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    3. it is from another translation.

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  5. As one weight is falling, another is rising and so they exchange positions and continue the rotation.... does that sound about right John...?

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    1. Gravittea... That's correct... The weights act in pairs... As one goes up it's partner pair on the opposite side comes down... Like a See-Saw... They change place and continue... But there's a catch...

      You have to get the required designing of the lever-weight system...

      Which is yet to be conceived by any BW enthusiast...

      This is the heart of Bessler Wheel...

      Believe it or not...

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  6. I don't like the term 'falling' because it implies free falling, or at least it is impossible to tell what people are really implying when they say it.

    Falling means falling as in 'I fell to the ground'. You don't say I fell down the slide,or I fell down the ladder, or I fell down the elevator, unless you really fell of course.

    A controlled lowering of a weight on the end of a bar is not falling in my definition.

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    1. I don’t mind the word falling but you make a reasonable point. The word falling sounds as if the object is falling in an uncontrolled manner rather than moving downwards in. a specific path.

      JC

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  7. Quote...

    when an object is set to rotate centrifugal force is produced at no expenditure of energy. Centrifugal force is more or less like gravity. Therefore, Gravity's too must be capable of setting an object in a rotation and in doing so the rotation must be capable of performing works. This is the simple logic behind the Gravity Wheel.

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  8. Gravity can be replaced with magnetism to make make a BW perform...

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  9. Therefore, the entire credit of running BW shouldn't go to gravity...

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  10. RAF John, What is your thought on Mr.Wolff's statement about the iron spring ?

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    1. I don’t know! RAF, but we know he thought he recognised the sound of a spring expanding but I’m not even sure what that sounds like. If it was to do with the removal of the weights prior to translocation then who knows? The way Wolff describes it, it sounds like a long noise as if the spring had quite a lot of travel in it, which doesn’t really tell me much. Maybe it wasn’t a spring expanding but rather Bessler sliding the weights onto a long lever which made the sound of the weights sliding along a metal bar sound similar to an expanding spring? Sorry but that’s the best I can do.

      JC

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  11. A boing/vibrato/twang noise not a sliding noise. where ever the wheel stops theres a least one of the five mechs sprung displaced, and ready to 'fire', hence the self starting
    Jon

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  12. I agree with you... It is not a sliding noise by any count... But, the five mechanisms,...

    Well, I don't think BW ran on five mechanisms... It has got to be more... Remember the eight banging sounds...

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  13. I have thought about this a lot, I wish I knew the answer to it. I don't have much faith in professor Wolff mechanical ability's-----------it might not have been a spring at all. No way of knowing for sure, Sam

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  14. Professor Wolff is very much right Sam... If you doubt him you will stand to lose the most important clues... He has given out most important clues... I can understand why you are skeptical about it... It is because JC sir once stated somewhere that Wolff cannot be fully trusted...

    It is the spring alright... Every lever comes attached with a spring... These springs make the levers swing faster without which the wheel's motion would be adversely affected... This twang happened during a demo when Bessler pressed a lever to extract a weight to be shown around...

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    1. Suresh, What can I say, you must be right; I stand corrected! Sam

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  15. We certainly are having a great discussion about the validity of many items and how they all fit together to allow the mechanisms to allow us the privilege of receiving the blessings that are and will be available from a wheel that is actually turned by gravity. We are all in your debt for providing this forum for the exchange of thoughts and ideas about how to accomplish this wonderous task. How are you coming with your build John?

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  16. RAF Thanks John for your thought. M.T. 18 indicates the spring/ weight setup and Mr. Wolf concludes that "elastic arms" are situated at the wheel rim. Weights falling GENTLY against the rim can't be done with levers only but springs going into tension could. Your comment John? Also, what was Bessler concealing by wrapping a weight in a kerchief ?

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  17. Probably a hole.

    Marinus.

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  18. Marinus, Yes, I agree, a hole in the end with a setscrew, to keep it from sliding off the end of a rod. He did say the weights were attached to rods.
    Also, I get the feeling that the end of the weights hit a board at the rim of the wheel. It's my contention, he was describing a sliding rod, with weights attached to the end of it. If the lifter weights were close to the weight of the slider, they wouldn't hit very hard. I'm know, i must be wrong, but that's what he seams to be describing. Sam

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  19. Follow up, as far as springs, i just don't know------------Sam

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    1. I think off two simple leaf springs (like; http://www.aps-ct.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/Flat-Springs1.jpg ) attached to the end of a wooden rod. The weight is clamped between the springs and is able to roll within the clamped springs.

      I don't think it slides. There are weights at both ends (pairs) and it must be swinging. (maybe tumbling.)

      Marinus.

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    2. Kids playing with their rods; https://www.obs-de-opstap.nl/fotoboek/polsstokspringen

      I am dutch :)
      Marinus.

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  20. Wolff wrote that he heard the familiar sound of a spring expanding upwards, which to my mind means it was compressed first and then allowed to expand upwards. I assume the spring was compressed by weights being added to it in some way. If a lever was within the confines of a spring then the weights were slid down the lever onto the the springs which were kept compressed until sufficient weights had been added at which point they were released pushing the weights upwards along the lever to its end?

    Or the lever had a spring at its base which was compressed by rotating it downwards in an arc to allow the weights to be added. Once added they were then allowed to lift upwards to a balanced position?

    But I still think the spring sound is not important to the basic design, but thst is just my opinion.

    JC

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    1. So what sound does an unloading spring make? Boing!!!

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  21. The springs are irrelevant and not part of the solution. They are merely used for construction or enhancement. Bessler said so himself that the springs are not responsible for the movement and that they are there just for enhancement and that it would also work without the springs because the wheel is driven by the weights only.

    The rod I described earlier is pivoted but I do not know where. I have read somewhere that Bessler said; “He could have pivoted them in the middle”. So it is probably not pivoted in the middle. I think it is somehow like a unbalanced wipwap that act as a, positive or negative, lever depending on the position within the wheel.

    Marinus.

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  22. Gravity provides the initial impetus which is greatly amplified by other efficient tools, inside the BW, like the leverage of lever-weight system, swinging movement, ball bearings., Etc., And this is further boosted by CP, CF, inertia, angular momentum., etc., to keep up the overall wheel motion perpetually...

    This is the best possible definition I can think of to explain the mysterious power source behind the bessler wheel...

    The energy released by this method appears far much because we don't consider these various processes involved...

    A very efficient combination of lever advantage and other actions of different forces involved results in an unbelieveable and magnificent motion constantly counter acting against the negative effects of gravity, isn't it?...

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    1. Nope, gravity is the continuous force that drives the wheel. The design is such that equilibrium is only reached at a certain speed depending on the load.

      Marinus.

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  23. I think you are a pretty clever fellow Sunresh, I agree with your evaluation.... are you building a wheel currently?

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  24. Thanks Gravittea... You may find it hard to believe but I have the complete blue print of BW in my mind... I have worked out every detail... The inner mechanism is very astounding... found nowhere... Just like what Karl had observed... To me BW is no more a mystery... but, I haven't yet started the practical build yet... If you where close by I would have gladly joined you in recreating the Same... I am a bit lazy and there is no one to assist me... You are a nice man who can be trusted....

    Most people are Shrewd and business like... BW can be actually understood by genuine guys like you...

    I have one advice for anyone interested in BW... Never underestimate or look down on anyone or anything while trying to discover something of this magnitude... You never know where a vital clue can come from...

    Once again thanks...

    Good day

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    1. Ok everyone, look away so Suresh can give Gravittea the secret because he can be trusted...

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  25. Bessler stated that springs are not the source of movement to counter particular accusations that it was wound up like a clock spring, and that provided the drive, read carefully translations of what he said in what context, he also stated they were used, he didnt qualify it with a 'but dont have to be' or 'in this wheel', just they are used, and tellingly never mentions springs again after such important information was imparted.
    Jon

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  26. Suresh, Thank you for your kind words. Today, I was able to make so incredible discoveries about the basics and their interactions that I had never thought of before. There is just no substitute for a build. There is a magical balancing out of forces that almost cancel each other out, and then the over balance condition can take over. A balanced wheel cannot turn. How is your build going John?

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    1. The "patent troll" triplock on BW would disagree with you. He believes only a balanced wheel is overbalanced.

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  27. Gravittea,
    You are right; and the best way to over balance a wheel is with sliders. Refference MT-15. If you could find a way to reset the sliders, the wheel will turn.
    Are any of you working on sliders? Sam Peppiatt

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  28. No one working on sliders-----------------that's too bad, Sam

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  29. RAF Thanks John for your thoughts.I speculate that the weights were "pierced in the middle and attached by connecting springs" ( Acta Eridutorum 1715) The sample weight, about 4 inches diameter,with Lead density being 0.4 Lbs./cubic inch,was about 0.8 inches thick--a thick washer. In wrapping it well with the kerchief,He concealed the piercing (rectangular SLOT) ! This prevented the witnesses from knowing the flat spring's cross- section!

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    1. RAF, Didn't the "4" stand for 4 lbs.,(not diameter),? But it was cylindrical in shape. I doubt that is was lead. More likely a piece of shafting or, from a wagon axle. Lead is difficult to work with. Sam

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  30. Has anyone ever thought about what the unveiling of this wheel will mean for the global economy? It is going to shift global political balance of power. And what about the standard model of cosmology? This will be the bomb under the big bang theory.

    Marinus.

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    1. Marinus, Yes, I've often wondered what would happen. Some things would change a lot, other things not so much. Infinity magazine has some thoughts on what might happen. Surly it would provide cheep electricity for every one every where. I for one would love to prove
      the scientist wrong!!

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  31. Nothing of that sort... Marinus,IMHO... If you mean a noble prize, No...

    There exist so many unanswered questions... I wonder why no author on the subject has bothered to cover all this convincingly...

    300 years have passed and 300 more may... We aren't any closer to the truth... The bitter truth is no one still has any inkling of the secret movement of inner mechanism... We aren't even scratching on the surface... Just beating around the bush... And pulling others legs...

    No one is ready to grasp a fact whenever it is presented... Everyone has his own pet theory... Much chaos exists...

    Remember, when fusion power becomes a reality all other power sources will go into oblivion....

    BW may yet make it to the museum...

    RAF... I think Jon is different from John Collins... And, the concealment of the weights with a handkerchief is not for the same reason as stated by you...

    Sam... No sliders involved

    Gravittea... That is not the best way to over-balance a wheel... Not what Bessler finally did... And, practical building of the wheel is not very much necessary... As this could go on and on... Thought experiment is the key... Because of the wheel's simplicity and also for the reason of availability of so many clues...

    Everyone just note, don't ignore or brush aside any input from any quarter without giving it a try... Because I often find this is the main plague affecting this blog...

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  32. Suresh,
    No sliders, are you sure? Anyway, you should never build your wheel, OK? That way you will never know failure-------------------Sam

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  33. Sam... Don't be too hasty to conclude... I have mentioned two reasons for not straightaway going for the practical build... If you start building everything that occurs in mind then it would be time consuming, costly and still you won't reach anywhere... Bessler went through all that pain and it isn't necessary we go through it again and again... There are established clues by eye-witnesses...

    Well, if you still persist it is your baby...
    Go ahead... Tell me have arrived at anything so far... Many times I have noticed your desperation...

    The problem here with everyone is that they fail to realize how many years this could go on...

    Out of the box thinking is required... Try to find out what bessler was really scared of losing... you are just struck at MT15...

    If it were for only sliders then it wouldn't have taken 300 years... Sliders appear in many my drawings... It is too common... It occurs in everyone's mind... Something thing more subtle is involved dear... one fine day when I reveal that you'll feel why anyone didn't think of it before... Wait and see this for yourself... it is very easy to brush aside suggestions...

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  34. Suresh,
    Thanks for talking to me, but, you are wrong about one thing. You can't build a wheel with just your mind. Sam

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    1. If you know what I know you wouldn't be talking like this...

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    2. I just can't stop laughing. Here's what I know. You know nothing. Build it or shut up.

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    3. Anonymous, I wish you would stop being so mean to Suresh. He says he knows the solution. He is very convincing. This gives us all hope that there IS a solution. I don't know if I want Suresh to just give his idea away. Then the game is over. Its more fun if we all try to figure it out, and we have John and Suresh to give us clues...

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    4. Thanks Quazgaa... It is very heartening to see at least there exists a noble mind... You are really very understanding... I wish others had a fraction of your genius nature...

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  35. Follow up, It just dawned on me, that's why scientist say that it is impossible, they can't build it in there mind, so therefor it can't be done!
    Sam

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    1. You are wrong... They actually don't even want to try it out in their mind... They just don't want to listen about it...

      Both American and English patent office has banned patenting this...

      There have been too many false claims...

      But they'll surely accept a working model...

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    2. A "false claim" is a claim made without proof, just like your claims.

      Delete
  36. Dear Suresh, I wonder that too. How are you going to proof that your thinking is correct?

    Marinus.

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    1. I don't have to prove, dear... You either trust me or go ahead with your practical build... At the end, you will certainly get the proof...

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    2. Suresh, you DO have to prove you know the secret and that's the point. You don't have a working wheel so you have nothing but your thoughts, and they prove nothing.

      Trust in someone without proof is foolish and has cost many people their life savings. At this time all you are is a "Magic Bean" salesperson.

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  37. RAF John, Would you quote the whole sentence in Acta Eridutorum,1715,that mentions"weights pierced in the middle"? Thanks!

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    1. I’m only aware of Wolff’s letter, the same one where mentions the sound of a spring, and in it he does discuss the mechanics, but it’s all speculation. If I have forgotten something from Acta Eruditorum, I apologise. Perhaps someone can remind me?

      JC

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    2. RAF, See John Collins book page 89, Sam

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  38. Gravitational slingshots are used to speed up spacecraft and save fuel !

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    1. Correct, a gravity assist. But the current belief is that a small amount of the planet's orbital energy is taken and the planet will slow down a little. This is such a tiny amount that it can be neglected. It is probably also too tiny to measure.

      Bessler’s wheel will provide us with a new insight that there is another way of explaining this without the planet loosing orbital velocity. Energy will be gained from gravity without loss. Einstein taught us that gravity is a “tension” (curved space-time). This tension can be used to “create” endless amounts of energy.

      Marinus

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  39. We are not discussing about a normal wheel or machine... It is the BW... It was already built by Bessler... There are vital clues available, fortunately...

    We should always remember this...

    We just have to envisage the whole thing and refine the picture in our mind... and then after matching it with the clues go for the actual build... It is as simple as that...

    The internal mechanism of the BW is very simple and also very unique... Found nowhere... But easy to conceive in mind after a lot of mental racking... It finally falls into place... All this happened with me...

    If you go on building first without having a proper plan in mind it is only a futile experimentation... If you prefer it this way I have no problem... I have done my duty of pre-warning...

    You need to have a thorough blue print or design before you construct a building or is it the other way round, tell me Sam...


    If you hit upon the right things you will be extremely sure that it is the one...

    The main thing with the internal mechanism is its simplicity and granduer... A layman just can't understand these things and he will be experimenting practically till he gets exhausted... Everyone cannot be a successful inventor... That's for sure... And, there's no point in reasoning with one who can't comprehend these things...

    If you don't follow me it is ok... I don't stand to lose anything... Let's see who has the last laugh...

    I have given out maximum possible tips so far, Marinus... The problem is you are not able to understand my point...

    Pls go through my previous comments since 2010...

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    1. You are probably right. My question was improper and irrelevant. I hope you are not offended.
      Marinus.

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    2. Suresh, Perhaps I'm wrong also, please forget what I said, Sam

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    3. Don't make Marinus or anyone else waste their time by searching back through 8 years of posts. You sound like you want everyone to discover the wheel from your posts, but asking someone to search back through 8 years of John's blogs is asking way to much, especially considering all the posts you make. If you truly want everyone to see your clues, why not create a single post and itemize them.

      But why stop there, why not just post the solution. You say you want everyone to learn the solution by looking at your clues. If someone figures out the solution using your clues, then you get no credit because you never really gave out the solution and they can simply say they figured out themselves. Only by you stating the solution are you protecting yourself. That is, assuming you really know it, saying so is not proof.

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    4. Sam... You always say this but internally you are rebellious... See Quazgaa... How candid he is... I try to guide you often but you never supported me like Quazgaa... He is more faithful than anyone here, obviously... I have a feeling I should stop reasoning with anyone here...

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  40. @anonymous. I totally agree with you. This guy just goes on about saying i have the solution,believe me. Dont do this dont do that, i have conceived it in my mind,it works. but i am too scared to build it cause i am i am afraid it could fail. Thoughts and imaginations are nothing. they cant even be affected by gravity so why sound so confident and condescending on something as intangible as "thought". Its like he doesnt know that all PM seekers have at some point had that idea they were 101% sure was IT, they would have staked their own life on how confident they were it would work, only to build a prototype to discover how wrong they were. the good thing is building a prototype helps you understand what went wrong and how it can go wrong.
    I dont understand how one can have the solution and just sit on it, no time or strenght to build but plenty of time to comment on blogs about how you have got the solution. What do you want us to do? We should say ok since suresh has got the answer we should go back to sleep boys, wrap it up, the search is over. Why? because someone says he has got it. No proof No working build. Not even to himself talkless of the general public. the truth is all builds work fine in our heads , the trick is successfully extracting it from our minds to reality. A test which has always failed else we all wont be here.
    So to suresh i say this. I am not saying you are a liar or a fraud but you have to understand that a working wheel in the mind no matter how efficient or grandeur cannot generate 1 watt of electricity in reality. You have to build. Succeed or fail. You have to build. Or at least dont discourage people who are willing to take the risk to succeed or fail.

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  41. It appears that some just don't understand or try to grasp what I am endeavoring to encourage... That's ok... It is quite natural to have distractors... I am glad atleast some are with me... Without something solid in my mind I can't be so confident or give away so many tips... But people here fail to observe this... This is the greatest folly or mockery... or Whatever that may be called...

    Bessler built a wheel... How many believed him... People lack patience... If you build a wheel the next attempt by the public will be to coax the inventor to reveal the secret...

    Your invention isn't safe till the coast is clear... It is better to wait for the right time to reveal...

    I can easily notice it is only such persons who lack patience and an understanding of what is being discussed protest... They are also the ones that are desperate to find the solution... By hook or by crook...

    These days most lack a discerning mind... Despite there being so many clues there is still no solution in sight... Rather than being ashamed of this some try to get after the one that offers so many tips to prevent budding enthusiasts from straying away from the right track...

    I still strongly believe that thought experimentation is the right approach followed by the prototype...

    Gravittea, Sam, RAF, Marinus pls make your voice clear if my interference is a nuisance... I will get into the silent mode immediately...

    My findings or understanding so far... Believe it or not...

    There is only one success configuration or design...(internal mechanism)
    Thought process or forming of complete mental picture of the solution is the right approach prior to building the prototype... Or it could take ages for sure...
    All the clues out there are true except two...
    Clues to be matched after forming a complete mental picture...
    Clues also come to aid now and then when in doubt...
    Gravity is the main power source...
    Springs are used to speed up the process of swinging...
    No sliders involved.,.
    No pulleys or ropes involved...
    Children are the weights and pillars the levers...
    Gravity also is used for lifting the weights on the ascending side...
    Lever-weight system is heart of the matter...
    Artful arrangement of weights is mandatory...
    The total weights are in even number... like four, eight or sixteen...Can't be five...
    Weights are arranged at equidistant points...
    No sling shot or catapult effect is involved...
    Simplicity is the key...
    Unconventional thinking is required...
    With the present way of approach it could take several decades...
    No one yet anywhere has an inkling of the inner mechanism...
    This BW design is not seen on any other machine in this world... It is quite unique...
    Swinging is an important aspect... Can't do without...
    Discerning vision is necessary...
    Patience is another criteria... With the way the current anons react here is only damaging...
    Build it or shut by JC sir is not the right way... Think up right and build it or accept failure or assist others is the right one...
    It doesn't makes good sense to reason here with most... They're best left alone...
    Even building the wheel is no guarantee... People will still insist on seeing the interior...
    They wouldn't even believe a video...
    Inner mechanism depicts our solar system...
    Common sense or logic mostly doesn't prevail here...
    What, which and whom to believe is out of question here...
    Most of us here are quite unmatured and laymen...
    It is hopeless and worthless to guide anyone here...
    Gravity has got to be tricked to make lifting of weights possible...
    The term PM is the main culprit that confuses scientists into thinking that BW is an impossibility...
    Every bit of idea or suggestions should be welcomed and debated... Not condemned...

    To be contd... After seeing the nature of response...






















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  42. @Suresh . You just dont get it do you. The issue here is you. You are very convincing, so convincing to the extent that i actually believed for a while that you are right but the thing is you havent built a working wheel. How do you expect everybody to believe you 100% when you dont have a working model. You dont have to post pics or show anybody but if you affirm here that you have built a working wheel , tested and confirmed. people would actually believe you. There is this unshakeable conviction that comes from having something real, tangible, possible. Imagine Mr A saying i have the answer but i havent actually tested it. How would you view him? compared with Mr B saying I have the answer, built and tested. We all would be more inclined to listen to Mr B rather than A. Its as simple as that.
    let me pose this theoretical question to you. If you drop a glass bowl from 100ft and it shatters into 737 pieces in your imagination/mind/thought. Can you be so certain that if you drop the same glass bowl from a 100ft in reality it is going to break into that exact 737 pieces???

    No matter how good your mind is at simulating real life physics it cant compare with reality.
    You have the answer right? Why not test. Not for anybody ,not for the world but for yourself. Believe me if you commented tomorrow that you have finally built a prototype and it works, i wouldnt doubt you. thats how convincing you are, thats how much people on here believe you.

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  43. "There is only one success configuration or design...(internal mechanism)"
    Suresh Kumar must be God.

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  44. It will take some time fif me to build... I will certainly do that and confront you...

    In the meantime, how are my other tips?...

    I have come up with so many suggestions and many times they have been quite convincing...

    You also seem don't seem to understand ehwh I am trying to convey...

    Since it will take some time to build my wheel what is the harm if I share...

    Why you guys make such a fuss in a very unpolite manner... This can also be dealt in a different nice manner...

    You don't know and you also don't bother to find out what is the caliber of the person you are dealing with... His advanced age... His long experience... straightaway start trolling... Is it right?...

    I would like to know how much contribution you have made here like me...or are just born to attack and suppress...

    This blog is good... But some in anon disguise do not know how to convince...

    You just want a working model... Definitely it will follow after some time... But why do you sound so critical...

    Just in a recent comment in this post Gravittea has made it clear how useful and enjoyable are the discussions... It appears you are either jealous or you are unable to tolerate... You don't want this atmosphere to continue...

    Just make it clear by taking it up with all the active contributors like gravittea, Sam, RAF, Guazgo., Etc., That if my suggestions are welcome... I don't mind... I will get into the silent mode...

    Pls don't think I am annoyed with you for advising me... No... But you could have entered with a different approach...

    When you spend some 30 long years like me 24/7 all the 24 hrs just dwelling deep into BW you will be able to understand much...

    I have some hurdles to confront before I start building...

    During this long voyage I stumbled upon the wheel's internal intricacies as if I got enlightened...

    With so many clues out there we are very fortunate... It helps mental work out...

    Bessler wheel technology is not rocket science... There is a particular pattern or artful arrangement... When the lever-weight system are placed in a particular way the gravity takes care of the rest...

    And, this way of special arrangement is so extremely simple but not found anywhere in the world... And it can be so nicely conceived in mind since it is not a rocket science...

    Further matching it with the clues nails it...

    It is then that you realize that you have finally achieved success...

    Pls note I am not here charging for it or making any demands... It is a free volunteer service sharing and guiding...

    You will never find another person giving away so many tips...

    I have been on this blog for eight long years and also I am quite aged... And I don't deserve to listen to your hard and rough and unpolite advise... I am quite ready to go silent... From now onwards...

    The problem with you is you don't consider others constraints...

    You are being too critical... Actually, we were enjoying till you dropped in...

    You are struck with only one point... Come up with the build first and then we will believe you... This is your policy...

    Let JC sir and others express their hatred and I will fade away...

    I just wanted to be a part of this society and also to try to gradually bring out the wheel through this blog...

    I don't know who you are yet and I have to bear with you so much...

    Do you think that I such a murk that I don't know that a working wheel is more convincing...

    Do I have to learn it from you... Do you really have to troll me this way after me struggling so much...

    Will you be more patient and less critical in future...

    Or do you want that I should remain out of this scene...

    You are ingoring or missing out the goodness and struck with only the build part...

    Who wouldn't be convinced after seeing a working wheel?

    Contd...

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  45. You are tutoring me as if I am a child with A and B examples... I bet you aren't half my age and experience...

    Don't you feel by chance it may be possible that I hold the key to the BW solution...

    I suggest that JC sir look into all my questions and ensure it is addressed... It I am worth it...

    Sorry rolling...but you really made me speak up so much... Just think dear it is possible that I may be right... There is a possibility... Don't lose heart and let's be comrades...

    It is not easy to solve BW by a single person... Unless you are a gifte one...

    One just can't afford to miss so many inputs...

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  46. This is John's blog. You are being rude to him by talking about yourself.

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  47. Come on suresh. be a good sport. I wasnt rude neither was i harsh though i admit i wasnt nice. I apologise if i ve given offence. I realise people are different. The truth is the world views people that would dare venture into what we do as numbnuts and that wouldnt change unless You and I change the narrative. Trust me If or When you build a working model, the world wouldnt just embrace it, you can bet there will be a lot of resistance to it at first. What do you think, an invention that will literally destroy a Trillion dollar industry(oil). Expect Friction.
    Develop a tough skin, take criticisms, take insults. it doesnt hurt. it is your mental resilience that matters.
    You dont have to go silent on account of me, there are a lot of people here that value your contribution.
    I actually dont believe in the BW , but i believe it is possible to build a self sustaining wheel using gravity. so i dont come here for clues but for inspiration. seeing other people who believe and are enthusiastic gives me the strenght to not stop searching. Sir JC has been on it for over 40 years and like you said you have spent 3 decades. I havent even spent a tenth of that time searching. so i think of you guys and think if they didnt give up why should i give up?
    You get me.
    Even though you dont have a working wheel you have earned my respect.

    Nobody hates you, i cant speak for others but i know i dont.

    Peace.

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  48. Thanks, Rolling... I didn't realize... I actually dozed off after a little spat with you... You are really nice internally... I mean your inner mechanism (heart,Soul) is great... Tell me, why do you call yourself as Rolling... You know names mean a lot... That is why Bessler also went for a name change by calling himself Orffyre...

    I hope there is something to be learnt from our discussions... I hope in future everyone is good to everyone else... I must admit I also learnt something from you... There's something great about you which I lack...

    I also hope no one insists on a working model before proper discussions and understanding take place...

    Let me tell you a tiny story... There is mystic from the mountains, a preacher, who has undergone a spiritual experience... And, starts preaching... But suddenly, a few among the gathering start protesting... They persuade him to practically produceproduc of God first... The pastor's repeated assurances simply fall on deaf ears... They finally lose patience and Lynch him... And thereby, the possibility of knowing about God is lost forever...

    You are a nice human being... We all lack something... JC sir also is great... More than the life efforts he has made in coming up with so much about bessler it is the creation of this blog... We are able to exchange a lot... Whether I survive or not but my heartfelt good wishes are there for this blog... It is unlike other blogs... Where we can sometimes express our anguish and aspirations also... There is yet so much to be learnt...

    I agree I have many short comings... But let me make it clear that really, as stated by you, I am not a liar nor a fraudster...

    The best thing about Bessler is that he was honest... The best thing about JC sir is that he is very tolerant, informative and brings inspiration, now and then... Bessler wheel should take rebirth right here... It is quite possible... We can do it together...

    Well, thanks again...

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  49. anytime suresh.
    Rolling as in roll-ing. continuous rolling,rotation,spinning. I actually chose the moniker in a hurry.

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  50. RAF WHEW!! Things are sure percolating now,eh John? Thanks John and Sam for your thoughts on Acta E.!

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  51. RAF Sam---The weights were about 4 pounds,the 4 inch dia. is estimated from Wolff's "could be held in the hand". Lead is very easy to cast in molds Sam. The slot for springs also cast,not machined,using hardwood strips.

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    Replies
    1. RAF, Four inches in diameter? Are you sure? I thought they were more cylindrical in shape. I guess you are right about the lead, it does take up less space. But, still I find it difficult to deal with----------------Sam PS At least we are "Rolling" along!

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    2. Follow up, I'm going by John Collins book page 71. A good thing about the cylindrical shape, you can easily machine the length to with in .010" of an inch, to keep the weights all the same. You get what I mean? If you keep the length the same, the weights will be the same, which is important, Sam

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Gottfried Bessler, a litttle speculation.

Following up my previous post, I’ve received a couple of emails pointing out that Gottfried Bessler, Johann’s brother, might be another pot...