Sunday, 12 February 2017

Johann Bessler left Clues both Textual and Graphic.

It has always seemed obvious to me, that if Johann Bessler was genuine he would have wanted to leave precise information in a publicly accessible place, about how his wheel worked, otherwise without a sale, he could never dream of final acknowledgement of his amazing achievement, even if it was after his death.  The options are limited to placing such information in one or more of his published works, leaving it for post humous discovery, either connected in some way with his private vault, or in his papers which had not yet been published, including private notes, letters and of course his Maschinen Tractate (MT) which he never got around to publishing. He obviously intended to publish it but his circumstances prevented it.  We already know that some important information had originally been included in his MT because he says so on the frontispiece, that he has burned or buried some pages which reveal the secret but a careful study of the remaining ones may eventually lead to the solution.

This short piece of handwriting on the front of the manuscript, with its strong hint that the secret is available to those with eyes to see, has tempted many researchers to study the 141 drawings, some of which have short notes attached.  For me the secret has so far remained too well hidden, apart from the final page, curiously numbered 138, 139, 140 and 141, as if this page replaces the four he removed.  It does offer some interesting pointers, but more is needed I believe, before sense can be made of the odd collection of items, which I labelled the 'Toys' page, in my original biography of Bessler, 'Perpetual Motion; An Ancient Mystery Solved?'

The MT is also full of other pieces of code which seem to hint at hidden information, but although these can be readily identified, what information I have been able to interpret seems too scant to be of use. But there is another researcher (O) who has made some astonishing discoveries within the MT.

But with or without the mysterious MT to guide you, there are ample other areas suitable for study, which were clearly intended to lead the determined researcher to the solution.  Apologia Poetica, was Bessler's personal account of his long search for the secret of Perpetual Motion.  It contains a number of  different encoding methods, all of which appear to be legitimate and carry a hidden message.  I'm not going to go into them all in detail here but you can learn about some of them by visiting my other web sites all of which are listed on the right side of this page.

Logic suggests that somewhere there must be drawings which were intended to help us get to the secret of the wheel, because all the words in the world will never be equal to some graphic explanations. The only problem is that the drawings must be extremely cleverly disguised.  KB has claimed that he has managed to extract much encoded information that he says he discovered within the two portraits Bessler included at the front of his last and most professional publication, Das Triumphirende.  I cannot comment on what he has found as I have no idea what it is. Das Triumphirende, was a selling aid or advertisement for his wheel.  It is written in both German and Latin, which was  clever because all lectures at universities were carried out in Latin, so it would seem that he was appealing to the more intellectual members of society in the hope of gaining some credibility among those elite.

Within this book are a number of drawings which depict his wheel from various viewpoints and positions and these were very carefully drawn.  Again there are a number of what I would call, discrepancies, apparent errors, which litter the drawings, which might give the impression of carelessness, but a closer look shows how precise the drawings are.

JC

143 comments:

  1. I think on contrary, it seems he deliberetly muddled everything... The clues are all over the place. We can only trust the eyewitness accounts...

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    1. I agree with you... Your points are too accurate and extremely brief... Bullseye shot... But what intrigues me is why you opt to remain as an anon despite such good contributions... Another thing that intrigues me most is the clues said to be in the portraits... The success to recreating BW lies in its designing...Size, measurements and weight are secondary and depend on output requirement... How can we make out that artful design from the portraits?...

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    2. The eyewitness accounts are important because they are not written in the same vague style Bessler used. But, sadly, those eyewitness accounts are few in number and far between. They, however, can be combined with details from Bessler's writings, and some of the hidden clues in the DT portraits to obtain valuable information about the internal mechanics Bessler's wheels used.

      For example, using the estimate of the Kassel wheel's axle bucket weight I mentioned below (especially after it had been partially filled with water), some eyewitness testimony of official test results, and some of the information revealed by the hidden clues in the second DT portrait, it's possible to determine exactly how far away, horizontally, the center of gravity of the Kassel wheel's active internal one-directional wheel's eight weighted levers was located from the center of the axle on the descending side of the axle. This distance, when revealed, will be quite a surprise to many.

      Correctly interpreting the DT portrait clues is no easy task and Bessler did not intend it to be. One must, literally, first find his design before the portrait clues even start to become meaningful and obvious! One must actually slowly duplicate all of the research Bessler did to find his first working Gera prototype wheel (the 3 foot diameter one, not the 4.5 foot diameter one) and then, as occasional successes are achieved as he moves ever closer to obtaining that final working design, he must then use them to verify interpretations of various DT portrait clues. But this bizarre process also works in two directions. When a particular portrait clue can not be verified by a particular design factor one is testing, that factor must be altered until it finally produces success at which time the particular portrait clue becomes verified.

      Needless to say, since there are about two dozen factors involved in the design Bessler used, there are at least this number of clues hidden in the two DT portraits and finding them all can take a lot of time and effort. I have expended that time and effort and now have most of these critically important clues located, correctly interpreted, and condensed down to several chapters with many illustrations. And, incredibly, after working at it for years, I don't think I've located all of them yet! No doubt, when I reveal the internal wheel design I've found, it will enable future researchers to progress farther than I have been able. My work is only a beginning step, although a major one, on the way to a full understanding of all of the DT portrait clues. As I ponder them, I am impressed by the sheer amount of effort that Bessler must have put into the embedding of the many clues in the two DT portraits so that, even after three centuries, no one other than myself could find them (and even so, by the greatest of luck!). This must have required weeks and perhaps months of work. They are yet another tribute to the man's incredible genius and tenacity.

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    3. But still all this looks quite far fetched live alone the complication part...Why not make it just simple...if it was so intricate why did Bessler fear so much about losing the secret...Your explanation is like telling to go around the head just to hold nostrils... There is no guarantee even after going through your publication that one can figure it out...If so you would have already done it by now rather than leaving it to other enthusiasts to build...Only a practical build can prove... Whatever you say Ken let me be frank...You simply don't seem to be convincing... Bessler even couldn't convince many despite being in possession of a working wheel... How do you expect all of us to believe...If we can't agree what you are saying no one will... This is what you are oblivious about....It would be far easier if one would start from the scratch... Instead of probing the portraits...Where has it lead us so far...I am quite sure you are not in a position to build the wheel with the available info... Expecting others to follow up is going to be another fact contributing to the already delayed rediscovery...Why don't you give this a thought...

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    4. @ Suresh

      "Why not make it just simple...if it was so intricate why did Bessler fear so much about losing the secret."

      I have made it as simple as possible by providing a large chart that gives the precise values for all two dozen factors for all of Bessler's wheels. With that chart a craftsman can then proceed to duplicate one of Bessler's wheels and even his more complicated bidirectional wheels if he is ambitious enough. As every serious pm chaser eventually realizes, keeping the center of gravity of a one-directional wheel's eight weighted levers on the descending side of a wheel's axle is an extremely difficult feat to accomplish and all of these factors must be present and correctly so for a particular drum diameter size of a Bessler type imbalanced wheel if the builder wants it to manifest the pm effect. I really wish Bessler's design was as "simple" as those shown in MT, but, if it was, it would have been found centuries ago.

      Bessler knew that some of the public attending his demonstrations were actually rival inventors. These were people with considerable mechanical ability and were eager to find out the slightest bit of information that they could from what they were allowed to see so they could immediately use it in their own imbalanced wheel designs. Bessler did not want them to have that information because he feared that it might allow one of them to duplicate his basic design in, perhaps, only a few months and then proceed to sell it for only a small fraction of the 100,000 thalers that Bessler demanded. If that had happened, then all of Bessler's struggling over the course of a decade would have been for nothing! To prevent this, Bessler had to be very careful about who he let test his wheels up close and supervise them so that they did not try to take a peek inside of the drum near its rim to see the uniquely shaped levers he used or how they were connected together with cords and suspended by springs.

      In public demonstrations he took the precautions to keep people away from the Merseburg wheel with guard rails he placed around it and he used stamping mills to hide the sounds coming from a wheel's drum as its weighted levers landed on stops on the drum's descending side. He even saturated the dyed linen cloth on the side of his bidirectional wheels' drum with oil in order to hide any oil stains that might form in dry cloth and show a rival inventor where the pivots of the wheel's eight active weighted levers were located. His greatest fear was that some inventor would try to sneak into the room where a wheel was kept when he was not around, open its drum, and then make a detailed sketch of the shape of its weighted levers and how they were arranged inside of the drum. He always made sure that all entrances to whatever room containing a wheel were securely locked when he was not around and, in the case of the Kassel wheel, multiple guards were on duty at all times to guarantee the security of his invention. Some may say that he was just being paranoid, but he knew that there were many of his contemporaries who would think nothing of stealing his invention and declaring that they had actually invented it. He took no chances when it came to security.

      After he had completed his little 3 foot diameter Gera prototype wheel and was testing it, he got into the habit of disassembling it after each session and hiding the removable parts around his shop. Good thing, too, because shortly after he made the discovery someone broke into his shop and stole some items. But, none of them were parts of his wheel.

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    5. Well Suresh, I want to stay anon because I am a working engineer. I do not want to tarnish my career... But I like this story very very much :) Let me tell you my opinion, if he really is genuine, the secret must be very very simple. Please remember the Karl's comment. It is the most valuable comment in this whole story. It is either a very deliberate hoax, or, it is an extremely simple way of thinking.

      BS

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    6. You are right again... But, if you feel it is a genuine case then there is no question of the image getting tarnished...Intact, you should come out in the open and fight it out... This case is worth it...I believe it can be easily solved as long it is kept simple.... Anyway, it is really refreshing to observe that there are people still who believe in its simplicity...I am greatly eased...Why don't you say more about the wheel...You are very much right...I think why people make it more complicated is because they haven't started from the scratch like Bessler... They feel it is impossible that way...They use SIM and believe too much in the codes...Now, things have become so much distant...Karl wondered why no one had thought of it earlier...

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    7. Thanks Suresh :) We are on the same page. SIMs use work-energy principle which the very thing Bessler's wheel doesn't obey. I am really not sure about if the wheel is genuine. Actually, there is only one thing that makes me feel like this is a hoax; The MT book... Why do you write a book and say "when I pull the curtain you will see"... That is rather odd. What type of book is that? Would there be before the revelation and after revelation versions?! It smells like a scam.

      BS

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    8. BS wrote:

      "Why do you write a book and say "when I pull the curtain you will see"... That is rather odd. What type of book is that?"

      MT was intended to reveal the secret of Bessler's wheels with at least four illustrations after his invention sold. Then, in November of 1727, Bessler's fired and disgruntled maid, prompted by his main detractors, filed a bogus fraud charge against him and he was arrested. The charges were dismissed for lack of evidence and he never stood trial. But, when he got finally back to his home in Karlshafen, he realized how vulnerable he and his secret wheel mechanics really were. The authorities could, based on practically any trumped up charge by anyone, enter his home, arrest him, confiscate his notes, search the premises for any parts of his small demo wheel that he had hidden, and then reveal its secret in an open court whose records would then be publicly available for anyone to read. To maintain secrecy after such an upsetting experience, he removed the drawings from the still unpublished MT and burned them along with all other schematics related to his wheel's internal mechanics and buried all of the ashes on his property. After that, he simply carried the construction details of his wheels around in the only place he considered safe...his memory. I'm to the point now myself where, should my laptop's hard drive crash and the text and illustrations of my forthcoming volume be completely lost, I could produce, from memory, detailed schematics of his imbalanced pm wheel mechanics. Hopefully, that won't be happening, but I will soon be making a back up copy of the now partially proofread manuscript on a CD...just in case!

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    9. Actually, I don't understand this described by you about MT book..I haven't gone through it... But I have been racking my mind for almost more than 27 years on Bessler wheel and I am absolutely convinced that it really cannot be a hoax... There are so many factors that one should take into account...The eye witnesses role, the nature of Bessler, Karl, the written clues, the very nature of gravity itself, etc... Bessler faced a lot of hardship...His bad luck...his enemies and all this and more...If you deeply dwelve into all this you will agree that Bessler was a honest man but was too worried of losing the secret...If anyone had paid up he would have revealed no doubt...The wheel was real...It just takes a very open mind independently and also ensuring to be on the right track, while working out mentally, to attain success...The simple fact that gravity has huge potential should keep one going...

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    10. OK Suresh. I think I am kind of an open minded person. Let's accept this thing is real. Karl's comment is biggest clue in my opinion. And there is the famous toy page. It may literally look like a toy from that era.

      BS

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    11. @ BS

      If Bessler's wheels were a hoax, then they, imo, would have been the greates hoax in the history of humanity! I certainly will never accept that suggestion. There were just too many skeptics conducting the official tests of his wheels who checked every conceivable way he could have faked them and nothing was ever found. Eventually, all the skeptics could say was that his wheels contained a hidden spring powered mechanism that propelled them and as such could not run for more than a few days at most. That theory was finally shattered by the nearly two month long duration test at Weissenstein Castle that started in late November of 1717 and was ended in early January of 1718. Bessler even offered to let the wheel run for an additional several weeks just to prove that his wheel was a genuine perpetual motion wheel. But, that was deemed unnecessary and he obtained an official letter stating that what he constructed had successfully passed all of the tests for it including the duration test.

      I think Karl was being honest when he said that the internal mechanics of Bessler's wheels was "simple". But, the precise details of things which are simple can quickly become complicated. The basic principle that an internal combustion engine works on is simple to understand, but when one gets into the details of how the fuel and air are delivered to the engine's cylinders, how the engine is started, how the fuel/air mixture is detonated, how the waste heat in the engine is removed, how the byproducts of combustion are removed from the engine and scrubbed of toxic oxides of nitrogen, and how the mechanical energy the engine outputs is turned into the motion of the automobile, things can quickly get a lot more complicated. The basic principle of Bessler's wheels could be understood by a 6th grade science student. But, making the special parts for his wheels that demonstrated that principle in action took the talents of a master craftsman and, imo, a tremendous amount of pure luck to find. His success was like finding a golden needle in a haystack the size of a mountain!

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    12. Bessler wheel is nothing but levers and weights arranged in a special manner... That's all...This special arrangement is the main task one has to find...Rest all is secondary... Without first finding out the arrangement if one starts to go into the details then it is just pointless...And, speaking of details, there isn't much... Bessler wheel is just as simple as an automotive wheel how can we compare it to an automotive engine...I think we need to reexamine what Karl had written after his glance of the wheel's interior...

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    13. It can't be levers Suresh. Whatever you do, you cannot beat the conservative action. What comes down cannot go up as high in the next cycle. This cannot be beaten. For thousands of years, this is the case. There is no trick you can do, beleive in me.

      Do you know if Bessler or any other witnesses talked about magnets? A very small chance, but may be he used magnets.

      BS

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    14. @ BS

      I think you are making the same mistake that many skeptics make when it comes to an imbalanced pm wheel by thinking that there can never be any net change in the energy of a weight moving around a closed path in a gravity field. The weighted levers in Bessler's wheels did constantly lose the mass energy they possessed even though they always moved around a closed path inside of a wheel's drum. This is possible because there was always the same number of weighted levers on a wheel's ascending side as its descending side, yet the weighted levers on the descending side always dropped at a slightly faster rate than the ones on the ascending side rose. This difference in vertical velocities was effectively equivalent to having a collection of weighted levers that, after each rotation of the drum, had dropped a little farther than they rose even though they moved around closed paths in the Earth's gravity field.

      We have discussed the possible use of magnets in Bessler's wheels in the past, but that is not a viable solution. The magnets they used back then were basically pieces of cut magnetite or lodestone and they were not that strong. His 12 foot diameter wheels had outer rims that were about a foot above the floor and a foot below the ceiling and the rooms below and above the wheel's room were always checked prior to official testing. To be able to cause a wheel weighing hundreds of pounds to continually accelerate would have required very powerful magnetic fields and they just were not available in the early 18th century.

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    15. BS says "What comes down cannot go up as high in the next cycle".

      I say "What goes down, can go down with more force than the force required to raise it back to its initial height".

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    16. How do planets maintain their movements as well as their position?..
      All gravity based, isn't it?...

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  2. Ken is a leech who is too afraid to sell his snake oil from anywhere but another person's blog. If it was such a great discovery, why not use his own web site?

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  3. Interesting you should mention the Kassel wheel drawings in DT. I'm currently reviewing those drawings and found some interesting things in them. See that little bucket in the second set of wheel drawings? It's attached directly to the 8 inch diameter axle with a rope. I made some very precise measurements on it and determined that its weight was about 5 pounds empty and it could hold up to two gallons of water without spilling. With a full two gallons in it, it would have weighed about 21.72 pounds Purpose? By carefully adjusting the amount of water in the bucket and its weight, it was used to determine the direct constant startup torque of the huge 12 foot diameter, bidirectional wheel after it was given a "gentle" push start to get its axle turning. Needless to say, those inspecting the Kassel wheel immediately realized from this highly accurate test how little power the wheel was capable of outputting compared to a conventional water or wind mill. Of course, those criticisms would have immediately been dismissed by Bessler as he told them that by making wheels with massive enough weighted levers, large enough diameters, and putting enough of them on a common axle, the power needs of any potential buyer could easily be met. Meanwhile, steam engines capable of outputting far more power 24/7 with a constant supply of coal were being developed. Bessler really only had a very narrow "window" of opportunity of maybe a decade to sell his invention and see it become commercially successful before its steam and soot belching competitors pushed it from the technological scene. Unfortunately, that window slammed shut before Bessler could use it. One wonders how much different the next three centuries of world history might have been if that window had stayed open a little longer...

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  4. I note that you consider saving a copy of your book on a CD Ken? CDs are passé, you would do better to save it to an online storage facility or a memory stick.

    JC

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    1. I have zero trust in any sort of online cloud storage setup. If one reads the Terms of Service of these, he will see that they do not guarantee that the material stored with them will be safe. No, not for me. I have played around with memory stick storage gadgets, but they also have problems. Again, not for me. CD's are quick to make and I then have possession of the data and not some facility somewhere that a hacker might decide to break into to steal data from or even delete it. Come to think of it, I don't really trust the internet, in general, when it comes to recording data. I've heard too many horror stories about people that "built" websites on free host sites only to return months later and find the entire site had been deleted! What I like about putting data into a POD book is that the data is stored on multiple optical discs that are kept securely locked away. Websites can come and go, servers can crash, and hackers can delete files, but if someone orders a copy of a POD book, say, a century from now, they will get a brand new, freshly printed copy. POD books, unlike traditionally printed books, never go out of print! Like Bessler's wheels, they are eternal!

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  5. Some sort of tricks are involved in the wheel's internal movement...But can they really be called tricks?...Levers produce some advantage...The swing helps in covering long distance in less possible time...This really gives another advantage... Angular momentum is also an advantage in the internal mechanics in BW...CF & CP is one more...inertia also..The secret special design of of the main moving parts (levers & weights) beats them all in giving the most advantage...And finally, another secretly designed structure that aids the movement of the swinging levers augments all the above...Now we can imagine why the wheel wouldn't stop from its ceaseless spin...A remarkable feature here is Bessler made sure that the same gravity that acts advantageously on the descending side also partly helps in the lifting of weights on the ascending side..This is the highest form of ingenuity displayed by bessler which has not been thought of in entirity by any one so far... Believe it or not...

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    1. CF was actually both an advantage and a disadvantage! Bessler's wheels' internal weighted levers were very delicately balanced against each other and depended on that condition for their smooth shifting about during drum rotation which maintained their center of gravity on the drum's descending side. However, as a drum began to accelerate, the increase in CF acting on its weighted levers began to delay that shifting on the drum's ascending side. That delay then caused the center of gravity of the weighted levers to swing down and toward the punctum quietus position directly vertically below the axle. As that happened, the torque of the axle would steadily decrease. So, in a sense, CF had the advantage of limiting the maximum rotation rate of a wheel, but it also had the disadvantage of only allowing the wheel to have its maximum torque and power output at startup.

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    2. Bessler's wheels' internal weighted levers were not delicately balanced...One side was always heavy.. infact, the wheel had to be restrained by tieing when not in use...you are stating the shifting of weights as per results obtained from you SIM tests...But when you work this out mentally as Bessler did the story would be different... All you stated above would be different too...as far as Bessler wheel rediscovery is concerned SIM based research results would be quite misleading...Let us do it the Bessler way...You will be amazed at the outcome...

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    3. If you were able to reach into the drum of one of Bessler's one-directional wheels and place your hand under the weight at the drum's 9:00 position, you would find that you could lift it with only one finger and by applying only a gentle lifting force. This was because of all of the stretched suspension springs attached to the weighted levers leading the one that you were trying to lift. This sensitivity guaranteed that a weighted lever would begin rotating back toward its rim stop just as soon as its pivot passed the 9:00 position of a clockwise turning drum.

      As far as my WM2D sims are concerned, I have high confidence in what they are indicating. That program must follow the known laws of mechanics when it shows a mechanism working whereas what an inventor just doing "hands on" research will, sadly, usually build things that he eventually finds out only work in his imagination. Imagination is a nice thing and it will work for very simple mechanical systems. But, as the number of parts and the interactions between them increases, imagination becomes very unreliable.

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  6. So Ken, correct me if I've got it wrong. There are 40 connecting cords in your design; there are eight mechanisms; the energy comes from minuscule losses of mass from the weights. Is that right?

    JC

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    1. That's basically it, John. There were 8 weighted levers in a self-starting wheel, each carrying a single cylindrical end weight made of lead (a bidirectional wheel required that two back to back one-directional wheels be contained within its enlarged drum). All of the weighted levers were linked together by coordinating cords and 40 of them were required. However, at any moment, only some the 40 cords were tight while the remaining ones were loose (which cords were tight and which loose changed somewhat during each successive 45 degree segment of drum rotation). Bessler's design depended upon a precise asymmetric starting configuration of the weighted levers that placed their center of gravity on one side of the axle which, when the drum was released and began turning, would naturally become the descending side of the axle. The weighted levers were actually supported in this asymmetric starting configuration because of the stretched suspension springs attached to them.

      What allowed his design to work while all others failed was that, as drum rotation took place, most of the stretched springs would slowly contract and thereby keep pulling their weighted levers toward the drum's descending side. That action then supplied the energy needed to keep raising the center of gravity of all of the weighted levers at a rate that exactly equaled the rate that the rotating drum was trying to lower it and, thus, the axle experienced constant torque acting on it that could accelerate the wheel or, if the wheel rotated at a steady speed, power outside machinery attached to its axle.

      It's really a very simple design, but it is, like all of Bessler's inventions, incredibly clever. It depends upon a specially shaped lever with the cords attached to specific locations on it. The suspension springs used must also have a precise spring constant and unstretched starting length. The energy needed to initially stretch the springs was energy that everyone else's designs were just wasting by allowing it to turn into unwanted sound and vibration. Bessler, however, realized that wasted energy could be recovered, temporarily stored, and then used later on in the drum's rotation to act as a prime mover force. During drum rotation most of the springs were acting as prime movers while some of them were in the process of being made into future prime movers as the energy other failed design wasted was being stored in them.

      Ultimately, all of the energy that just seemed to mysteriously appear in Bessler's wheels could only have come from one source which was the mass of the weighted levers themselves. If one does the calculations using E = mc^2, he will realize that a single 4 pound lead weight has an enormous amount of energy locked up in the mass possessing subatomic particles (basically electrons, neutrons, and protons) that make up its many, many lead atoms. Bessler's imbalanced pm wheel mechanics was able to very, very slowly extract that energy and mass during drum rotation and transport it to other structures in the wheel and even the moving parts of outside machinery attached to the wheel's axle. Even after running for years, the weighted levers in his wheels would only have lost an amount of mass and weight that would not have been measurable by the equipment then existing and can only today be measured using very advanced equipment. From his writings, it's obvious that Bessler thought he had the best pm wheel ever made and the only one that would ever be made. I, however, am not convinced of that. In fact, when the full details of his secret mechanics are revealed, I believe that their basic principle described above will be able to be used with modification in various other types of designs and I will look forward to seeing others do just that.

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    2. Ken, I will let you and everyone in on a little. The secret principle is about the "when" the weights shift rather than the "how" or the "where". Focusing solely on the mechanism is why the mechanic will never find the solution. z

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    3. You can't draw the solution.

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    4. I quite agree that the "when" that shifting takes place is critically important. For example, in a clockwise rotating, one-directional Bessler wheel, the weighted lever at the 9:00 position of the drum must start swinging outward toward the rim and away from the axle immediately as their pivot passes the drum's 9:00 position. No delay can be tolerated or the center of gravity of all of the 8 weighted levers will immediately sink toward the punctum quietus as axle torque drops to zero. This is why I mentioned to Suresh above that the 9:00 weighted lever must be very delicately counter balanced by the stretched suspension springs attached to the several weighted levers ahead of it as well as the weight of those levers on the drum's descending side.

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  7. Sry, I forgot one thing here.
    I have hidden some "clues" in to those videos also.

    PLMKRN

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    1. Seems that there can not add any links here anymore!
      This was quick replay to my first comment and without link, this post is meaningless.
      So, John you may delate it.

      PLMKRN

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    2. https://m.youtube.com/user/palmkroon

      You have to paste it in.

      JC

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    3. Thank´s for hint John :)
      I made it twice, as you suggest here, but strangely this was not working as usualy.
      In this post I tried to point out video nr 2 (and 3).
      And my question was: Do you want to see what is under the hood over there?

      PLMKRN

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    4. ... indeed. I would love to see the details.
      Very interesting videos, btw. Fascinating work.

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  8. this one have nice plastic parts and for gear builders. looks like must work but does not. i dont think gears are in besslers wheel.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jgAnponHWgU


    boris

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    1. That's a very interesting design he has, Boris. He's shifting the weight at the end of the arm around in the so-called "xz plane" which is a plane which is always horizontal. His design would not work even if it had the other three mechanisms completed and installed on the other arms. This approach does not work because, as the "wheel" rotates, all four of the weights on its weight gears, if they had been installed, would actually be constantly rising vertically relative to the Earth's gravity field. This is not apparent from studying such designs because the viewer only notices the circular motion of the weights in the horizontal xz plane which creates a deceptive optical illusion. It takes a constant energy input to keep raising those gear weights as the arms of the "wheel" rotate around the axle. That energy input actually uses up 100% of the GPU that would be lost by the dropping of the offset center of gravity of the device if it could drop so that none is left over to accelerate the device and it remains balanced in any position. I have also seen variations of this device in which the weight gears rotate in the yx plane and they also do not work. For a design like this to work, the energy required to keep raising the weights on the rotating weight gears must be less than the GPU that the "wheel's" center of mass would lose if it could fall. Yet another approach that looks like it must work on paper, but fails miserably when a physical model is made.

      Fortunately, this approach has nothing to do with the one Bessler used because there were no gears in his imbalanced pm wheels despite what Wagner may have erroneously believed!

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    2. Another Roberval Balance variation. The increased torque due to the weight shifted outwards is countered by the inner gear, axle, stand, and ultimately the Earth. Nevertheless, there is something worth using in this design. Keep at it boris. You are close.

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  9. I will check your blog John, but this is my final post here.
    As a professional engineer, I admit, John, you give very good, satisfactory answers against every anti-Bessler argument, strange but Bessler wheel seems genuine.

    Best luck to you all :) I hope one of you will find a solution.

    BS

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  10. I have found that the subject of Bessler's wheels, oddly, has something in common with the subjects of paranormal phenomena and UFOs. With those latter two topics, if one starts out believing, as the skeptics do, that all of the reported events are hallucinations or hoaxes, then he will never make any progress in determining what the actual physical principles behind them might be if some of them are, in fact, real. In essence, he will be, figuratively, throwing the baby out with the bath water! To make progress in any mysterious subject, one must try to keep an open mind and focus on what seem to be the best authenticated reported cases of that subject. So, it is with Bessler's wheels.

    One must avoid the temptation to automatically dismiss his wheels as hoaxes just because practically every other such invention ever offered proved, eventually, to be either a deliberate hoax or a delusion on the part of the inventor. This was the mistake that Wagner and Bessler's many other detractors had made when dealing with Bessler's invention. Because of that, they automatically sabotaged any possibility of themselves understanding how Bessler's wheels could work and their negativity may have even been partially responsible for the inventor not being able to find a buyer despite the advantage that Bessler had from the patronage and association of Count Karl. The only reason I was able to make any progress in understanding how his wheel's internal mechanics could work is because, immediately from the beginning of my study of Bessler a long time ago, I realized that the probability of him having been able to deceive all of the skeptics examining and testing his wheels was actually far lower than the probability of his invention being real! Only if one accepts that they were genuine, can he hope to make any progress in understanding them.

    But, one might ask, don't his wheels violate the Law of Conservation of Energy that every high school science student is taught is impossible? Surely, that proves Bessler's wheels must have been fakes.

    Actually, Bessler's wheels never violated that law and physically could not. If what I've been suggesting was the source of their motive power (the energy content associated with the mass of their weighted levers) is accurate, then each of this wheels only contained a finite amount of usable mass energy that it could be outputted to perform usable work in its environment. When that mass energy was finally expended (and, thus, the weighted levers finally became massless), one of this wheels would then coast to a stop and remain stopped until and unless its weighted levers were replaced with new ones having some mass and weight. This process, in essence, would really be no different than replacing the dead batteries in a child's toy in order to restore its functionality. The difference, however, between the toy and one of Bessler's wheels is the latter could, with newly installed weighted levers, continue to run for billions of years!

    So, try to remain optimistic everyone, I can virtually guarantee that this year of 2017 will be a very different and satisfying one in the three century long history of Bessler's wheels.

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  11. Mass getting converted to energy...Hmmmn... Sounds a bit odd... There must be some other plausible explanation... This issue needs to be cleared first...

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Actually, it is not necessary for mass to be "converted" into energy. That's because mass is already energy! Mass and energy are the same thing at all times. Wherever one has mass, he also has energy. And, wherever he has energy, he also has mass. More importantly, whenever the mass of a system is increased, so, too, its energy content is increased. And, whenever the energy of a system is increased, so, too, will its mass be increased.

      What makes it difficult to appreciate this fact is that even a tiny amount of mass contains an enormous amount of energy. For example, using the famous E = mc^2 equation, we can see that a single gram of mass is equivalent to about 9 x 10^20 ergs of energy. How much energy is that? Further calculations will show that it's equal to the energy released when 21,500 tons of TNT is detonated! Now, consider one of the cylindrical lead weights found in Bessler's Merseburg wheel which had a mass of 4 pounds. 4 avoirdupois pounds is equal to 1814.37 grams. This means that each of the 4 pound lead weights in the Merseburg wheel was equivalent to the energy released by the detonation of (1814.37 grams) x (21,500 tons of TNT per gram) = about 39 million tons of TNT. But, wait! There were 8 of the 4 pound lead weights in each of the bidirectional Merseburg wheel's internal one-directional wheels which means each of those internal wheels which drove the drum in either of its two possible directions of rotation, contained an amount of energy equivalent to what would be released by the detonation of 8 x 39 million tons of TNT or 312 million tons of TNT!

      Needless to say, any wheel that could use the energy provided by 312 million tons of exploding TNT could run for a very, very long time. In fact, if the wheel was just running at its maximum free running terminal speed and only had to overcome some aerodynamic drag and bearing friction, it could, literally, keep itself in motion for billions of years!

      Such wheels, as Bessler obviously constructed, would not really be "perpetual" in the absolute sense of the term. They would, eventually, coast to a stop when the last erg of energy and fraction of a picogram of mass that their weighted levers contained was used up overcoming the various drags acting on the wheel's parts. However, as far as the average person is concerned, he could readily describe them as being "perpetual" without it being too much of an exaggeration.

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    2. Wrong on so many levels!

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    3. It's only "wrong" to those who are ignorant of modern physics which, quite unfortunately, applies to about 99% of all pm chasers.

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    4. Modern physics is what tells us that pm is mathematically impossible. Fortunately people's ignorance or maybe naivety of these laws help keep the dream alive in their pursuits to find a solution.

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    5. I quite agree that perpetual motion in the absolute sense of term is impossible because it is not possible to build a machine that will magically manufacture energy out of thin air. All energy a machine outputs must either be supplied to it from the outside or must come from a source inside of it. In the case of Bessler's wheels, they outputted energy that they were carrying inside of their drums. That energy was that associated with the mass of their weighted levers. Since that source of energy was finite, his wheels would not be able to run forever. However, rather simple calculations show that, while running at their maximum terminal rotation rates, they could rotate continuously for billions of years. Yes, not perpetual, but pretty damn close, imo. I will continue to refer to his wheels as "perpetual" even though I know they really were not.

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  12. What I can understand is that to lose mass some reaction has to occur like burning, nuclear, chemical or explosions,etc,...And such a thing is not happening in a Bessler wheel...So how can we say there is a very gradual loss of mass over a very long period?... Just because we don't know for sure from where the energy is released in BW....Is it the only way to conclude?...

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    1. Any process that lowers the energy content of an object will lower its mass. While it is true that there is a difference in mass between the products and reactants in such things as chemical and nuclear reactions, one does not have to have these to change the energy and its equivalent mass of an object. If one simply picks up a book from on shelf and lifts and places it on a higher shelf, the energy and mass content of the book will increase, but the increase will be very, very small. That increase in the energy and mass of the book will be "paid for" by an equal reduction in energy and mass of the body of the person lifting the book. Only by embracing these principles from modern physics will one ever be able to understand where the energy in Bessler's wheels came from.

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  13. I read somewhere that gravity is a force...It is exerted by curvature of space-time which in turn, is caused by masses...It imparts acceleration, kinetic energy/force, creates momentum...

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  14. Replies
    1. Many a pm chaser has had a short term love affair with them only to eventually realize that they are a pain in the arse to construct and offer no real advantages over a simple lever or pulley system. Indeed, they are only collections of simple levers themselves. They were not used in Bessler's wheels, imo.

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    2. Maybe If fitted with the weights in a simple but unique way???

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    3. Do you think Count Karl would describe a wheel loaded with scissor jacks with weights as being "simple"?

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    4. Just a thought, half extend with one weight fully extend with two weights, maybe worth looking into

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    5. From viewing MT 37 through 42, it's obvious that Bessler had a fascination with scissor jacks and in MT 41's notes we read:

      "I can assure the reader that there is something special behind the stork's bills."

      He even depicts them on the "Toys Page". However, when one studies these designs, he finds that they are all unworkable. They suffer form the same problem as the four arm wheel that Boris posted a link to a video of above. In order for these scissor jack machines (John's translator called them "stork bills" for some reason) to work as Bessler thought they might (we don't know if he actually built them, but he may have), as their centers of gravity dropped during rotation, they would have to output more energy than was needed to raise their weights to the positions shown. That is done in the one design Bessler found that worked, but not with MT 37 through 42.

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  15. Why don't we just accept that it is gravity in conjunction with other forces like CP, inertia, leverage,etc,.that powers BW? What's exactly is wrong with this theory? If Be derived power from mass alone for its sustenance then it should be able to perform in zero gravity situation as well..But it truly can't, can it?..

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    1. Bessler's wheels needed a force field to function, but they did not need gravity. One could mount one of his wheels in a centrifuge and when the centrifuge was made to rotate fast enough to create a g force equal to the Earth's at sea level, the wheel would run just like it would in Bessler's home. Actually, in principle, it should also be possible to make a Bessler type imbalanced wheel work in an electric or magnetic field. There might even be some way to make it work by having springs pull all of the ends of the levers in the same direction. Such a design would not need end weights on its 8 levers and could work in any orientation relative to the Earth's gravity of which it would be independent.

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    2. Ken - your book, is it a comic book?

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    3. @ Uneqk

      No, it's a combination of early 18th century history, autobiography, physics, mechanical analysis, and clue analysis with major emphasis on the only place in all of the Bessler literature where one will find the specifications of Bessler's secret imbalanced pm wheel mechanics given in detail. It is not a book of translations because I long ago realized that, even if one had perfect translations of everything Bessler wrote, he still would not be able to reverse engineer his wheel mechanics from them. It's intended for the most serious of Bessler researchers that are finally tired of endlessly struggling for success and getting nothing in return for their efforts. I am confident that they will be very happy with what I have to offer. Of course, one can not please everyone. As I've said in the past, there are pm chasers that will only accept a solution if they are the ones who find it. Also, as I've said previously, I'm only the messenger boy in this situation and delivering the message to future Bessler wheel students that Bessler wanted them to have. I have invented nothing, but that's okay because he already did all of that for us.

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    4. Ken, your confidence is very high, and it will be nice if your right.
      I hope you didn't come down with a Big Bump.

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    5. Big Bump??? My confidence is high because I've seen some truly amazing things in the last six or so months. Things I was starting to think I'd never see. Soon everyone else will be seeing them too!

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  16. Force field....I agree...So some force field or force is reqd.... And, where there is force energy can be derived from it...This is another way of saying that BW cannot function without some force or force field...Not necessarily mass....Lead weights were specifically used to derive power from some force...Be it gravity, magnetic, Centrifuge or springs...And not exactly from mass... Because you cannot directly convert mass into energy... There has to be some reactive medium like burning, fission,etc,...Since gravity is not fully understood by science presently we cannot rule out the possibility of deriving energy from it...Hydro power projects use gravity by employing turbines or wheels to convert water falling force to energy... Similarly, BW converts gravity force to energy by employing falling weights....

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    1. No, Suresh, all of the energy that Bessler's wheels outputted came from the mass of its active parts which, when he used gravity, was from the atoms of the lead end weights and the levers themselves which were not made of lead. If one uses an electric or magnetic field or spring tension and there are no lead weights at the ends of the levers, then the energy would just come from the mass of the levers themselves which were quite heavy. Also, once again, there was no need to "convert" the mass of the weighted levers into energy. They were already energy and his imbalanced pm wheel mechanics just made that energy / mass "flow" out of the weighted levers and into the other structures of the wheel and even a little would flow back into the weighted levers themselves as their speed around the axle increased. When trying to understand how one of Bessler's imbalanced pm wheels worked, we need to begin to think about energy / mass being allowed by the wheel's mechanics to naturally "flow" from regions of concentration (the weighted levers) into other areas such as the steel suspension springs, the drum, the axle, the air surrounding the wheel, and any outside machinery attached to the axle. This process is in agreement with the Second Law of Thermodynamics and is similar to what happens when heat energy flows from a hot object to a cooler one with which it is in contact.

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    2. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JW68goC4_es

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    3. Thanks, dougsbous, but they sound a bit on the lethargic side. Maybe they are all exhausted from spending months and months building wheel designs that all turned into yet more non-runners for their collections of such? I'm hoping that the announcement of the rediscovery of Bessler's secret imbalanced pm wheel mechanics followed by working replicas will produce a reaction more like this:

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RsDgMNiF71Q

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  17. Very good reading
    https://openparachute.wordpress.com/tag/physical-law/

    PLMKRN

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  18. What if the lazy tongs are a chain with collapsible links?
    If the pantographs fold up like a dart shape, or the A's with a bent crossbar, you will have a variable pitch cog wheel, maybe this is hinted at in MT 137.
    Bessler's wheel could be a circular avalanche drive.

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  19. Matter still not comprehensible...A weight on the descending side falls and thereby performs work...This is solely due to gravity...As understood by a layman like me...How does the atoms of the mass of the weight happen to shed themselves?...Is gravity stripping atoms from the mass during the fall?....Pls explain briefly in an easy to understand way...I am sure many like me on this blog have yet to come to terms with this...

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  20. I understand only kinetic energy and potential energy...And I think Bessler wheel works on these principles..I also read somewhere that matter can be converted into energy through nuclear fission, annihilation or burning...Or through chemical changes/reaction..We eat food and perform work... What does BW eats?..

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  21. What's the difference between the Wright Brothers and those who think they know the secret to Bessler's Wheel?

    ANSWER: The Wright Brothers actually proved beyond the shadow of a doubt that man could fly. They didn't need computers to draw up simulations to "Achieve" there goal. Many people criticized and challenged the Wright Brother's beliefs and asked them to build a flying machine and prove that man could fly.

    So.....They BUILT "MANY MODELS" people! The key word is "MODELS"! A Bessler Wheel will NEVER accomplish ANYTHING on PAPER. An actual construction of the wheel MUST take place in order to silence the nay Sayers.

    Like they say...(The proof is in the pudding, NOT on PAPER!!!)

    YOUR'S truly...

    Mr. Anonymous :)

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    Replies
    1. Looks like we have all got to start from scratch, so its back to the drawing board !Woops! Sorry I meant throw the board away and lets get building. The problem is what are we building? Does anyone know.

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  22. https://plus.google.com/collection/wOuox
    rollable weight cycle comprehension hints - Collections - Google+

    https://plus.google.com/118295092547933782328/posts/1jGiappZmX7
    needs tweaks and mirrorring of (misallocated rations / proportions) even but it's a good one to get you started thinking on these things .. the leverage cycling principles involved ... i reckon ...

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  23. We all need energy of some sort, us humans eat food, combustion engines drink fuel, electric motors need electric and so on.
    Gravity sucks off weight, and has Bessler's wheel is made of weight Gravity keeps tugging, so Bessler's wheel doesn't actually eat anything, instead he's food for gravity

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  24. Suresh wrote:

    "A weight on the descending side falls and thereby performs work...This is solely due to gravity...As understood by a layman like me...How does the atoms of the mass of the weight happen to shed themselves?...Is gravity stripping atoms from the mass during the fall?....Pls explain briefly in an easy to understand way...I am sure many like me on this blog have yet to come to terms with this..."

    There is no change in the number of atoms in the weighted levers or the subatomic particles they contain. All of the subatomic particles in those atoms simply loose a tiny bit of mass and its associated energy with each trip they make around the center of the axle. How this happens is caused by the weighted levers on the descending side of the drum always dropping vertically at a faster rate than the ones on the ascending side vertically rise. This results in the descending side weights losing energy and mass at a slightly greater rate than the ones on the ascending side gain it back. That slight difference in rates of the flow of energy and mass on the drum's descending and ascending side then results in some extra energy and mass left over that can be used elsewhere in the wheel. One can think of this extra, left over energy and mass as being extracted from the weighted levers which then, literally, flows out of them and into all of the other moving structures of the wheel to cause them to accelerate or, if they are moving at a constant velocity because of the drag of outside machinery being applied to the wheel's axle, the energy and mass will actually flow into the moving parts of the attached machinery and try to accelerate them. It's really a very simple process and, most importantly, it's the only way to explain where the energy came from that Bessler's wheels outputted. Sadly, most pm chasers are completely unaware of how this works and can only focus on one thing which is trying to keep the center of gravity of their wheel's weights on the descending side of the axle. Unfortunately, as demonstrated in that video Boris linked to above, that, by itself, is not necessarily enough to create pm. The design in that video violated Bessler's clue that "in a true perpetual motion nothing must be stationary on the axle".


    Uneqk wrote:

    "Sorry I meant throw the board away and lets get building. The problem is what are we building? Does anyone know."

    You will soon know exactly what you must build if you want to actually see some results in your lifetime.


    Mr. Anonymous wrote:

    "A Bessler Wheel will NEVER accomplish ANYTHING on PAPER. An actual construction of the wheel MUST take place in order to silence the nay Sayers."

    I couldn't agree more, but a glitch free sim that works is a great place to start.

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    Replies
    1. At the moment, due to lack of my technical understanding, I have no other way but to yield..

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  25. A big clue can be made out from the way Bessler behaved...He was always too worried that someone could steal his secret with just a glance...So he had the wheel covered... All this only indicates that it is the design that he felt was vulnerable...Not accurate measurements...Not size...not sounds..Nor the heaviness...If it is only the designing that matters then we needn't be too worried about the codes carrying critical measurement details...We might as well only try to imagine that secret design which went to the grave and can't be retrieved by conventional methods...

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    1. I actually had the basics of Bessler's design around my model #700 or so, but it would not run. It actually took another almost 800 models to finally find the values of all of the precise parameters of its parts that agree with the values given in the two DT portraits and which also produced a working model wheel sim. This was probably one of the most difficult projects I've ever worked on. I can assure you that while the basic design is simple, the details of it are not. Every part of the drum's internal mechanics must have a precise shape and mass and all of the weighted levers must be held in a precise asymmetrical starting configuration by coordinating cords of precise lengths and suspension springs having precisely matched spring constants. A slight amount of variation is permitted from the precise values, but not much. If there is more than just a small deviation in the nearly two dozen parameters involved, then the wheel's mechanics will not be able to maintain the center of gravity of its weighted levers on the axle's descending side during rotation and one will only have yet another non-runner.

      Bessler knew that the average person catching a glimpse of his wheels' internal mechanics would not be able to duplicate them. He was mainly afraid of the inventors and mechanics in the crowds viewing his demonstrations. He knew that if they saw a wheel's internal mechanics, they would be able to duplicate them and probably rather quickly. The dyed and oiled linen cloth stretched over the sides of the drums of the Merseburg and Kassel wheels was primarily intended to prevent those experts from seeing his wheels' internal parts. Yet, he also wanted the secret to be preserved and made available to inventors in the future. That future is this year!


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    2. I actually had the basics of Bessler's design around my model #700 or so, but it would not run.....Well, well, and well.. This model number 700 may not have been anywhere near or closer to the actual Bessler design...Based on that your future evolved models too can't be said to be really matching the Bessler's design...It could be something different altogether...At the moment, before your book release, no one else has an idea of what the portrait clues are.... Everything here depends on your verbal assurances which is simply not convincing...And many of us are too sceptical.... Bessler even made practical demos and still many couldn't be convinced...Let me tell you something doesn't seem to fit in the picture...I can imagine the post publication scenario...We would be nowhere near the truth... Bessler story is genuine no doubt...But the various interpretations by others now don't seem to agree... Bessler's approach was entirely different...All these things you say about accurate details of the internal parts are related only to SIM workouts... This is a great truth that Bessler wheel can be achieved by an unlearned person or a carpenter guy...

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    3. Yes, at model #700 I did have the "basic" design, but the levers were still not shaped right, the spring constants were wrong, several of the coordinating cords were not attached to the correct points on the levers, the mass of my levers without the end weights attached to them were wrong, and, eventually, I discovered that I needed to add an additional coordinating cord to the design! I had the "basic" design alright, but it was only a very crude version of the final design, #1480, that actually worked.

      And, yes, a "carpenter's boy" could duplicate Bessler's wheel after studying if for a while. But, he would also need to have a schematic produced by Bessler as a guide that told him the various parameters that needed to be used for the wheel's internal parts because those would not be obvious from just viewing the wheel in motion. Quite fortunately for today's serious Bessler researcher, that schematic's data does exist. But, one has to know where to look for it and how to correctly extract the data from it.

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  26. Hi John,
    Ken's contraption with a million cords and special shape weights actually rotates will you accept it has being Bessler's wheel

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    1. @ Uneqk

      Bessler's design has 40 coordinating cords or 5 cords for each of the 8 weighted levers in a self-starting, one-directional wheel and they are arranged into several layers that keep things tidy. The end weights attached to the levers have no "special" shape. They are simple cylinders of lead with shafts bored down their central axes so an attachment bolt can be passed through them. The levers, however, are very specially shaped. Unless one knows the exact shape of those levers, he can forget about replicating one of Bessler's wheels. There are several places in the two DT portraits where Bessler tells the reader with a "discerning mind" what was the shape of those levers.

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    2. All these cords, what material are they made from, and are they incased inside a sleave

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    3. @ Uneqk

      In the plans I give for Bessler's little 3 foot diameter Gera prototype, one can used cords made from strong cotton thread. For larger diameter wheels, one can use cords of any flexible material that is resistant to stretching. That could include cords made from spun and woven fibers of cotton, linen, silk and even things like pre-stretched strips of leather or cat gut. Someone wishing to use more modern materials might consider strapping made from woven Nylon. For the largest diameter wheels with the heaviest weighted levers, one will move on to using actual hemp ropes or even lightweight steel link chains. Again, one can also use a modern material like ropes made of woven Nylon strands. I suspect that only a handful of craftsmen will want to make a exact physical replica of one of Bessler's wheels using all of the same materials for its parts as he did. Most will probably make modern versions with modern materials that will hold up better during long duration tests of their replicas. What's really important, however, if not the materials that one uses, but making sure the parts he installs in his drum have the same parameter values as the parts Bessler used. Because, if they do not, the use of high tech materials will not turn the wheel into a runner. One must pay particular attention to the shapes of parts, their placement within the drum, the balancing of the drum before parts installation to make sure its center of gravity is exactly at the center of its axle, etc. Making a full size Bessler wheel will be a very challenging project. For this reason, I strongly urge people to begin small with a replica of the 3 foot diameter Gera prototype. One should consider its construction as basic training for a more advanced project in the future.

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    4. I forgot to add that the cords are not "encased" in any kind of sleeves. They are fully exposed inside of the drum. However, they are carefully arranged into certain patterns among a set of layers that span the thickness of the drum so that they can not touch each other and rub together during drum rotation. Such rubbing, if permitted, would result in the cords very quickly failing and the wheel being disabled enough not to be able to maintain its motion. When all 40 coordination cords are properly installed, no two should make contact with each other during drum rotation.

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  27. Instead of trying to replicate Bessler's wheel, why not just design your own gravity wheel? Just use what you know and make it happen. There's no need to resort to a 300+ year old idea which nobody really knows if it will work or not. This is 2017! Surely the technology we have in today's world can achieve what Bessler did 300+ years ago. In fact, it can be done a 100 times better with outstanding power!.

    Sure we have computers to simulate what will happen but, why not just use as many or incorporate as many things as you can into the design? Like using all the elements like water, air, gravity, magnetism, heat, cold, ropes, pulleys, springs, ect...

    We have a ton of elements to use. It would be even better to just start sharing ideas that have real merit with each other so that we "ALL" can achieve the dream of free energy through our collaboration with each other. No need for just one person to have all the glory. Why not everyone just chip in a small piece of knowledge? I could start it off if you like?

    Perpetualman.

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    1. We live in a land where everyone is free to pursue whatever pm device design they please (and can afford to build!). I, however, am what is referred to as a "purist" when it comes to pm. My primary focus is unraveling the exact mechanics that Bessler used mainly because I am well convinced that he actually had a design that worked. I have personally tried many different approaches in the past and all came to nothing. My hope is that revealing how Bessler did it will be of assistance to those who prefer to find different designs that exhibit pm. Once his design is revealed, probably about half of those attempting to achieve pm will be trying to figure out how to use his principle in various different and, hopefully, more powerful ways. That's a "good thing", imo. Anyone who gets any sort of a pm or OU device up and running will be celebrated for his (or her) achievement whether it is the same as Bessler found and used or it is not. Your talk of "sharing ideas" certainly sounds fine and that is exactly what my forthcoming publication will do: finally share Bessler's actual discoveries with the rest of humanity although a bit delayed. However, I found out that on a personal level, inventors tend to be quite phobic about revealing the details of what they are working on. Like Bessler, they fear that they will be robbed of the fruit of their labors and someone else will grab the principle, cash in on it, and then go smiling to his bank to deposit millions of dollars. There can, imo, be no real "sharing" between two serious pm chasers. They can be friends, they can chat on the phone and maybe even get together. But, when it comes to taking each other into their shops to show off what they are currently working on, that's an entirely different matter.

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    2. Agree with Ken..That when it comes to taking each other into... Unless, one has reached his deadend...

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    3. Perpetualman, I agree with you that if we work more together then that must be more producative, in creating a working Gravity wheel(Bessler actual design or not). I appreciate that generally people may not want to share ideas on projects they are currently working on. At the least I believe we need an area (Bessler forum??) to display our non working attempts at a Gravity wheels and the reason for their failure/s. How many times have we all worked on a design, that I suspect others have previously looked into, and found and understood the reasons for the failure.
      Just a thought...
      A.N.Other

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  28. This comment has been removed by the author.

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  29. John, the Ken reality show is really taking off. Bravo! Soon, we can all thank you for playing a huge part in muddying the Bessler waters with a giant piece of steaming speculation.

    Up next? Ramananda's new book!

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    1. I think it's the unreality show, anon. Ken gets more and more unbelievable the more he writes. 40 cords! And he calls it simple. I really don't think Karl would have called it simple if he had seen a wheel with 8 weights and 40 cords all moving in a wheel of less tha 4 inches thick.

      JC

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    2. The 40 coordinating cords, really just sewing threads, in the 3 foot diameter Gera prototype wheel were contained in a space only about 1 inch wide! But, again, each of its diminutive weighted levers only had 5 cords assigned to it and the 40 were spread evenly around the outer 9.42 foot circumference of the little prototype's drum. In drawing the detailed schematics for this wheel, I realized that such a feat of "packaging" would have been simple for a clockmaker like Bessler to achieve and easily obtainable for a reverse engineer willing to use a thicker drum than would have been used on the Gera prototype. I should mention that 40 cords are required for each one-directional wheel. That means that a bidirectional wheel, which contains two back to back one-directional wheels, would require a total of 80 coordinating cords! But, such is the price that must be paid to achieve imbalanced pm, especially if it is to be bidirectional. Bessler was willing to pay that price.

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    3. Sewing threads couldn't have survived the long tests in sealed rooms..

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    4. Ken, with all the time you've spent writing your book and responding to blogs, you could've built 10 wheels by now.

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    5. I probably could have built another 10 non-runners for my collection. But, instead, I've opted to produce one volume that gives a design that will work if it is carefully constructed. I think I made the right choice.

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    6. @ Suresh

      The sewing threads were for Bessler's 3 foot diameter, one-directional Gera prototype wheel. The 12 foot diameter, bidirectional Kassel wheel that weighted about 800 pounds would have used either hemp ropes, leather straps, or even chains for coordination of its weighted levers.

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  30. Sounds like Ken has been looking at a cobweb in one of the portraits!

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    1. You see a cobweb in one of the portraits? Please indicate its location because I do not see it.

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  31. Ken said, "There are several places in the two DT portraits where Bessler tells the reader with a "discerning mind" what was the shape of those levers.".... We can see a few dividers or compass used in school geometry boxes in Bessler's DT portrait...

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  32. @Ken... Certain things you say can't be entirely wrong...But there are certain things you speculate that simply won't fit...One thing that is dangerous is getting on the wrong track...And, taking others along...You talk both sense and non...The energy part of the matter is yet to be ascertained...It is important that we do find out the energy source of Bessler wheel before embarking...It requires a force field...But not the force itself, right?...What I understand is that when a weight is raised it possesses some potential energy which is later converted to kinetic... Someone, other than Ken, has to unveil this... Without being sure of the type of fuel reqd does it make sense to design the engine first?...

    ReplyDelete
  33. Hi Suresh,
    You mention about being on the right track, but what is the right Track, at least good old ken is having ago.
    You mention designing the engine first. Tell me an engine that starts spontaneously.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Going off track is deviating from the guidances provided by the eye witnesses...All that's being narrated by Ken simply doesn't match the clues...The key to success lies in keeping the design as simple as possible...Just levers and weights...No cords...The correct design of the lever-weight pendulum is very critical...Ken throws more weight on cord instead...Now there exists some doubt on the energy source...We should get this sorted before attempting the wheel design...Of course, Ken has contributed much more than many.... This needs to be acknowledged...But most of the time it appears he is misleading the lot... Unintentionally.... Certain things what he says do not agree...But it is quite futile to get him listen to us...He has surpassed that margin...He will not listen to anyone...He is too sure he has found the secret...But in actuality, he hasn't...When the correctly designed lever-weight pendulum is arranged inside the wheel drum...The wheel will spontaneously start rotating...It will cause the wheel to weigh more on the descending side.. Always...Let me tell you a secret...None of us has so far designed this lever-weight combo.... This happens to be the main and only working part of the wheel...Now you can imagine how crucial this designing is...

      Delete
    2. Suresh, do you believe that there's more than one way to make a wheel rotate.

      Delete
    3. No...There is only one way...One design...The success design...The Bessler design...By studying all the drawings and eye witnesses account and the poem one can find a movement...The design...And how it works...The secret is in the designing and arrangement...

      Delete
    4. Suresh, in a sense I was hoping that you would suggest that there was more than one way, but I'm 99.9999% that there's only one way a apparatus can rotate, so Orffyreus either fooled the eyewitness or he never actually turned a wheel. but like you and john etc, I think it's quite possibly that he was telling the truth.
      So that means he must of push it to start, it's hard enough to get a apparatus to turn let alone start on it's own.

      Delete
    5. Bessler's initial wheels didn't require any push...They turned on their own...Even a a few grams extra weight on any side will make that side come down...

      Delete
    6. If you stood 20 - 30 people round an object and made it do something that's unique, then wound them up about hove fantastic it was, you can convince people what they have actually seen, and before you know it, you could probably convince them that it could talk as well, remember your talking about 300 years, most people love to exaggerate on what they say or hear.

      Delete
    7. Bessler wheel passed all tests and the test of time...It was genuine no doubt...It can be easily duplicated now...

      Delete
    8. Suresh wrote:

      "All that's being narrated by Ken simply doesn't match the clues.."

      What do you think that I'm writing that does not match the clues?

      "But most of the time it appears he is misleading the lot..."

      Please tell me how you think I am "misleading the lot".

      "It was genuine no doubt...It can be easily duplicated now..."

      People have been saying that for 300 years, but that "easy" duplication never took place. Guess it wasn't really all that easy after all. However, things are about to change!

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    9. Suresh,
      I'm on your side, I'm not trying to cause problems, I personally have got a lot of time for Orffyreus Bessler, but I'm not chasing he's wheels, that's down to you guys, but if your clues are wrong, the debate will go on forever, and people can argue for another 300years and still be no closer to solving it.
      I appreciate the chat,

      So can john and co including yourself hurry up and get to the bottom of this on going mystery.
      PS - Did Bessler live on a Hill?

      Delete
    10. Ken, where did you come From - me and Suresh was having a private little chat. lol.

      Delete
    11. @ Uneqk

      Sorry to butt in, but I was curious as to exactly what Suresh thinks I'm "narrating" that does not agree with the clues in the Bessler literature. He apparently believes that there were no cords in Bessler's wheels and that they were just levers and weights. He seems unaware that 22 of the first 40 designs shown in MT use cords / ropes! That's over 50%. If they were actually just levers and weights, then the design Bessler found and used would have been rediscovered centuries ago!

      Update:

      Well, I'm now almost finished with Chapter 1 and ready to "burn" the backup copy on a CD just in case my laptop hard drive self-destructs. This single chapter is actually almost book length by itself and getting it just right has put be behind schedule a little. There are still 10 chapters ahead that need to be proofread and corrected. I will try to speed things up as much as possible without compromising quality. I'm still optimistic about publication in April at this point in time.

      Delete
    12. Ken,
      In the nicest way possible, I think your over excited regarding your book, Ken you should slow down and take a break, your over working yourself.
      Ken we all know you mean well, but can I suggest you leave your book alone for a week and just listen in on johns blog. Look back over the last month or so on the blog and try and slow down.
      Bessler"s wheel has been hanging around for 300 years. What's another year or so?
      Slow down, I'm pretty sure most people will take to you about anything, but rest your book for a while.

      Kind regards
      Uneqk

      Delete
    13. Thanks for the advice, Uneqk. But, I'm the type that switches to high gear whenever there's a job to be done and stays in that mode until it's finished. In high school whenever one of our teachers gave us an assignment for a written report that was due in, say, three weeks, I'd have it done in three days! I've found that one of the worst things for success in life is procrastination. This happens when one lets his fears, doubts, and sheer laziness take control of his drive and, basically, shut it down. "Vacations" from one's projects can, unfortunately, often turn into permanent "retirements". How many great works of art, inventions, or scientific theories might have been if only the person working on them had not decided to take a break and then never came back to finish them because he got distracted with some other nonsense? As everyone's high school coach often said, "A winner never quits and a quitter never wins." Imo, it's just as true today and it was decades ago. For many, the only "progress" they make in life is coming up with more elaborate reasons why they should not make any effort to do anything at any time. Then, decades later, they cry the blues when they look back at a life devoid of any accomplishment. Sad, really sad. I want to stay as intellectually and physically active as I can as long as I can. When I'm a hundred years old I'll probably be working on some book that deals with some exotic topic that's caught my fancy and to which I think I have something important to contribute. Once one is dead and entombed, all of that comes to a permanent end. The time to make progress is now while one still has brain waves, a heart beat, and respiration! Stop waiting for your mood to be just right, for "inspiration" to strike, or for people, places, and things around you to change. If one does that, he will never make any progress in anything in life.

      Okay, speech over. Time to climb down from my orange crate and let someone else use it.

      Delete
  34. In rereading some of the above replies, it seems a few are bothered by the design I've extracted having 40 cords in it. I really wish it could be less and, for years, I assumed it was. But, that did not prove to be the case. From reading MT, one will realize that Bessler was not scared away from designs with a high number of cords or ropes in them. Consider MT 11 which contains 36 cords. Its notes read:

    "This figure is doubled, as one can see, and the form does not involve much, but there is more in it than meets the eye, as will be seen when I pull back the curtain and disclose the correct principle at the appropriate place, as mentioned previously."

    Bessler hints that it shows an important principle which he will discuss at the end of the book where he planned to provide illustrations of the internal mechanics used in his working wheels. He refers to this as the "appropriate place". MT 11 shows two one-directional wheels, one inside of the other, built into a single carrier drum. The two wheels are in the same plane and their spontaneous self-start directions are both clockwise. What would Bessler have been saying about it at the "appropriate place". He probably would have mentioned that, like MT 11, his bidirectional wheels also used two one-directional wheels inside of an enlarged drum. However, unlike MT 11, the drum's two internal wheels would not be in the same plane, but, rather, side by side and arranged so that their spontaneous self-start directions were opposed.

    Here's another example. MT 14 is also a design with 36 cords in it and part of the notes read:

    "...What is objectionable about this model, what to learn from it and how it can and may be used, will all be treated later."

    He hints that the design can be modified to make it work and that, again, he will discuss it "later" which is a reference to the end of MT where he was supposed to reveal the secret mechanics of his working wheels. The important principle shown in this MT drawing is the way Bessler uses cords to interconnect weighted levers on opposite sides of the axle and not just cords between adjacent levers. That's a form of coordination and intended to constantly shift the center of gravity of the weights over to the descending side of the drum.

    We see here some of the most general principles that Bessler's working wheel design used: a large number of cords, multiple one-directional wheels inside of a drum and on a single axle, and the use of cords to coordinate the motions of levers not adjacent to each other.

    The designs I found for his one and two directional wheels use all of these basic principles. But, my main point here is that one should not be bothered by that design using 40 cords. Bessler was not opposed to using them if he needed them and he did. However, as the number of cords in a design increases, some arrangement must be used to prevent them from rubbing against each other. It took me a considerable amount of time to finally unravel the method Bessler used. It will be seen to be simple and elegant.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Ken, your mind is indiscriminate and certainly not the mind needed to come to the answer from studying from MT, as illustrated by your 36 cords in 11 and 14. Those are arm chair playing with simulation numbers and not real world hands-on building numbers. The real numbers are two and seven.

      Delete
    2. I learned very little about Bessler's secret wheel mechanics from what was left of MT after he "edited" it other than that he used an imbalanced type wheel in which cords played a major role in coordinating its weighted levers' motions during drum rotation to maintain imbalance. However, the notation for MT 18 is particularly interesting:

      "This is the previous spring-model, and it seems to be good, but seeming is different from being. In the meantime, the principle should not be disdained or entirely disregarded, for it says more than it shows. I, however, will show more than speak of it at the appropriate place."

      Again, he tells us that there is a "principle" used by the wheel in MT 18 which he will discuss at the "appropriate place" which is a reference to the end of MT where he planned to reveal the mechanics of his actual working wheel design. MT 18 uses flat strip type springs in an effort to store ordinarily lost GPE as a weight travels from the 6:00 position to the 12:00 position and moves closer to the axle and then to suddenly release that stored energy to lift the weights back to their stops on the wheel's rim again. This principle, I found, was used in his working design and in a somewhat similar way. So, with this we have the basic components of his working wheel design: weights, levers, coordination cords / ropes, and springs. The challenge is to put them all together into a design that will work. Not an easy task considering it took me close to 1500 attempts! (Actually, more if I count all of the hundred or so designs I investigated prior to using WM2D of make simulations!)

      Yes, a person with a "discerning mind" might be able to, eventually, find a working design from studying MT, but there will be no guarantee that it is the same one Bessler found and used. But, he will do it a lot faster and have the exact one Bessler used if he, as I did, studies the two DT portraits! Imo, they are the only place in all of Bessler's writings where one will find the precise details of his secret imbalanced pm wheel mechanics. Overwhelming evidence of this will soon be forthcoming!

      Delete
    3. Hearsay and conjecture. Those are "kinds" of evidence, but hardly overwhelming!

      You only have one third of a clue vouching for you and that's the mercury. Good luck with that!

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    4. The clues are certainly not "overwhelming" and that is why I'm not overly impressed with MT. But, they are overwhelming in the two DT portraits! Btw, mercury was not used in Bessler's wheels. He preferred another toxic metal: lead.

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    5. There is no evidence that the second portrait was put there by Bessler, nor that it has anything to do with Bessler, let alone that it has clues buried in it. You see what you want to see. What are the checks and balances a real researcher would use to determine an ink spot isn't just an ink spot but some damn clue?

      Btw, mercury was not used in Bessler's wheel, but in Ken's lunch.

      Delete
  35. Ken, Ken, Ken. Please, please, please. Abbreviate, reduce the number of your posts and stop writing about your book!

    You are welcome to post here but my patience is fast running out. Please get your own blog, if you just want to promote your book - or is there some reason why you don't want to?

    JC

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    Replies
    1. Sorry, John, but I thought I had greatly reduced my references to my forthcoming "ultimate" Bessler book (so-called because it finally offers what I consider to be "the" solution to the 300 year old mystery)! I'll try to refer to it far less in the future except, perhaps, for an occasional brief progress update for those who are interested. Sometimes, however, when I read a comment by someone who, obviously, does not know the Bessler story and is, although unintentionally, promoting misinformation, I feel the need to "enlighten" him. From now on I shall try to read more and post less. Meanwhile, I have 10 more chapters to go...you guys are not going to believe what I have planned for publication!!! Get ready for the surprise of your lives! And, unlike most surprises, it shall be a very good one!



      Delete
  36. We are still, looking at the same question that I have been asked time and time again. Do You Have a Working wheel. If the answer is no, then all of this spew is just hot air and causing an enormous amount of pollution to our already over burdened planet. I have solved the mystery so many times that the wolf is howling at the moon...... I get the same dumb look from even my closest friends and engineers. They want me to succeed...... " I don't believe it can be done, but if anyone can do it I believe it will be you" " I am willing to verify your work, but do not call me again until you have an actual working wheel" I cannot blame them and their skepticism, they have seen it all before. I am a believer in his (Bessler's) work...... not yours. I Sincerely hope that you have solved the riddle but right now I don't believe you Do you have an actual, physically functioning working wheel? use your own blog

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    Replies
    1. By the end of this year, many will be believers and, most importantly, will have a design to work with that has not been seen in over three centuries!

      Delete
    2. You're concerned about promoting disinformation? Come on Ken, this book of yours is the most blatant piece of disinformation we've ever encountered and it isn't even published!

      JC

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    3. Fascinating...that's exactly the same way I feel about everyone else's Bessler "research"! Lol!

      Delete
    4. Great, then go back to cosmicvault.tripod.com and promote your book and critique the work of others from there!

      When I come here, I'm interested in knowing what John is up to, not you, Ken!

      Delete
    5. @ Anonymous

      I, too, am interested in what John is "up to", but he rarely shares the details of his wheel research here for one reason or another. He also admitted a blog or so ago that he only has a "principle" and no design using it (I suspect, however, that he did have a design using it that was simulated a while ago and showed it did not work which could be the main reason he does not reveal it). Also, didn't he also once encoded that "principle" into the beginning of each blog entry with a long alphabetic secret code to preserve it forever and establish priority to it and then, months later, mentioned that he forgot how to decode it! People have been waiting around here for ages to learn about this "principle" he has discovered and so far we're still waiting! I, too, am hoping to see more from him in the future now that his little cabin is finished and he can get some hands on work done. If that falls through, however, then he may be able to try constructing one of the designs that I will be revealing which I have much reason to believe is actually based on "the" principle that Bessler found and used. There is much honor awaiting the one who can successful physically duplicate a working Bessler wheel!

      Delete
    6. None of what you just mentioned give you the right to take over John's blog. You have a web site. Use it! Comment here on what John has to say. If people care what you have to say, they will follow you on your web site or blog.

      John has already asked you to use your own blog. If you can't honor that, then you are nothing but a parasite with unsubstantiated claims.

      Delete
    7. Ok, reasonable comments, Ken. The principle I discovered is still valid and it's true I lost the decoding method of the very same principle a while back, which was pretty stupid, but the principle is still in my mind. I have the design but even though I've built my log cabin and it's well insulated and has electric power, I haven't finished the interior neither have I wood preserved it. Our house alterations have finished (Friday) But we're busy bringing all the house contents back down from upstairs where it had to be put while walls were knocked down etc,

      So I'm doing drawings on the new wood disc I use to provide datum points for the anchor points. It's no secret that I have divided the disc into five equal parts for five mechanisms, which, by the way, include five lengths of cord.

      The source of energy is from the falling weights,

      One more thing I'll publish my research later this year because now I'm 72' I'm conscious of time passing and unlike Bessler, I wouldn't be content with post humous acknowledgement.

      JC

      Delete
  37. Ken. Please hurry up and finish your book. I think what you have to say about Bessler's wheels is interesting because I too believe that IF it was a gravity only wheel then more momentum in one direction could only result from a consistently displaced CoG. But in fairness to John this is not the place to indulge in your book. When your book is published do you think people will discuss your book and findings on this blog? I don't think so, so you will need your own forum. Why not promote that now so we know where to go?

    FWIW “God decreed that it should be the most unlikely person such as I, who would crack open the hardest nut of all, which no scholar had ever been able to do."

    "Jump up and down with gusto yourself, then, Wagner - then start tearing your hair out, because you'll soon find, you splendid mechanic, that this is a nut you can't crack!"

    Bessler seemed adamant that scholarly endeavour could not crack the nut of a PMM. That means that current Newtonian Physics descriptions may fall short, or that another energy source was used internally to lift weights into position.

    For 300 years scholarly endeavour has produced nothing.

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    Replies
    1. Best advice for you Ken. Get your own blog up and running so people know where to for information and discussion. Let me know and I'll post a link to it.

      JC

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    2. 390 words later, basically, "No, I'm too busy thinking about me to worry about what my cluttering and distracting is doing to you!"

      Delete
  38. I think the fact that Ken can write a book about Bessler and the possibility of him becoming the only person in history to discover perpetual motion, but still manage to devote 10% of the book to himself says it all really.

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  39. John, I am one of the many silent lurkers who regularly visit this blog as I find the subject of Bessler fascinating. Over the last couple of years I have followed your progress on the subject and various individuals endeavours to solve the problem. I have my own ideas and have even made some prototypes, one of which exhibits some unusual characteristics which I am currently pursuing further.

    Tis a great shame that your blog seems to have become mired in recent months by certain individuals who singularly wish to promote themselves rather than the greater cause. As a casual observer may I respectfully point out that this will serve to turn away many who might have posted items of interest but are now fed up with the constant spew by one individual as a self proclaimed authority on the subject. Surely this blog exists to nurture interest in the subject and provide a platform for exchange of ideas. For the reasons stated above I feel the constructive and informative quality of this blog is suffering.

    Your patience is boundless and admirable, but please, please, please......put a stop to this downward spiral for all our sakes! It's your web site and you have every right to maintain a standard of intellectual quality. I cannot speak for others, but for all the hours of interest your web site has given me over the years I hope you will take action to remove the offending party so we can return to a more stable and constructive platform.

    Carry on with the excellent work John and I look forward with interest to your forthcoming book.

    ReplyDelete
  40. I have, with regret, decided on a course of action which will, I hope, return this blog to its former state of gentle discussion with no single person hogging the bandwidth for his own purposes. I had no wish to censor any comment unless I found the language unacceptable, and I never would have thought this action necessary for the reasons which have become apparent in the last few months.

    JC

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  41. I have noticed that two of the replies I spent considerable time writing yesterday in an effort to stimulate some serious discussion here on the possible psychological motives of the pm chaser have been deleted by John. That now tells me that it's time for me to take an extended and most likely permanent break from this blog and let those complaining anonymous lurkers that have, so far, contributed zero of any value here fill the void that I will be leaving. Bye, bye.

    ReplyDelete
  42. There is an eerie similarity with what we are witnessing and Bessler. He would not tell anyone the secret and he was besieged by critics from all sides. I believe that a number of the clues that he left were just to send any seeker in the wrong direction. When his answers were too clever for the best minds of the time, they filed charges against him. He was in the process of leaving the actual clues for the world to claim, but he was so irritated that he removed the important clues and burned them. He really left us all out to dry and today the world is in desperate need of this wisdom. Lets all give our best efforts to bring this event back to the world. Thanks to our good sheperd John Collin and his tireless, relentless pursuit...... all these years

    ReplyDelete
  43. My-oh-my!

    I regret that I was not here for The Final Act for if I had been, it might have ended with a bang rather than a whimper and a sigh.

    Well, KB is one good and indefatigable writer. I'll unstintingly allow him that.

    Alas, blessed PEACE has now returned to JCNBS.com . . .

    J.



    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. but could be peace of ghosts town without him. i hpe he forgive and retnr to us soon.


      boris

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    2. Nature abhors a vacuum,
      someone will come forward, hopefully they will not have any theories about UFO's powered by "non - electromagnetic cyclotron radiation" drawn from the alien crew so as to provide fuel for the "anti - mass field generator."
      Or is it the other way round ?

      Delete

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