I think that the arrival of a working version of Johann Bessler’s wheel is imminent. There is so much new research into his Maschinen Tractate (MT) going on, particularly in the Besslerwheel forum, that the chances of success have never been higher. The whole purpose of the drawings and notes in that document was for the education of apprentices attending Bessler’s planned school for teaching various trades. Given his obvious intention to leave clues to his wheel extant after his death, plus of course the hastily scribbled note on the front of the document, it is clear that the answer can be found within those pages.
The note on the front cover, famously read, “ NB. May 1, 1733. Due to the arrest, I burned and buried all papers that prove the possibility. However, I have left all demonstrations and experiments, since it would be difficult for anybody to see or learn anything about a perpetual motion from them or to decide whether there was any truth in them because no illustration by itself contains a description of the motion; however, taking various illustrations together and combining them with a discerning mind, it will indeed be possible to look for a movement and, finally to find one in them."
There are other indications of his plan to encourage the reader to study the various drawings and through a comprehensive study of all them, discover maybe one real movement or action which will lead to the solution. There are 141 drawings in total with the first 55 accompanied by brief notes each one about the adjacent drawing.
I have made much of the clues and hints in his other three books, but have paid less attention to those in MT, but the current discussions about the drawings has raised considerable interest and I’m now pursuing a more thorough investigation of the MT drawings. There are a number of additional clues which seem to indicate something important but although you can make sense of what they could or might mean, it’s hard to confirm. I’ve discussed some of them in my web site at www.theorffyreuscode.com
Such urgent action by Bessler must have been caused by something that he felt endangered his secret and therefore he might have lost sole possession of the one thing that gave him hope for a his school, sound financial future, and fame. He declares that it was due to an arrest, but having been written in May 1733 doesn’t necessarily mean that he was arrested at that date but could have been responding to an earlier event which made him reconsider what information might be found in his files.
You can acquire a copy of MT plus English translation from the panel on the right, towards the bottom or from the top where is says “Bessler’s books and a. Biography” .
JC
141 bible references to 141 MT drawings .
ReplyDeleteI think that bessler had to add drawings ,after removing the proof from MT such that the total remained 141.
The fact that AP bible references equals MT drawings of 141 , which are two different works at two different times , indicates something , perhaps code related to MT , or ?
It does serve as an indicator that MT is complete in total amount though IMO.
JC wrote "There is so much new research into his Maschinen Tractate (MT) going on, particularly in the Besslerwheel forum, that the chances of success have never been higher."
ReplyDeleteIs this blog a rehash of a past one? I'm not aware of any "new research" into MT going on over at bwf. It's just the same boring babble about "wheels in progress" from the same small group of regulars there. I think most of them don't really care how Bessler did it. They just want to get anything that works and many are convinced we'll never know exactly how Bessler did it.
The only guy I know who's done any serious research into MT is Sayer of Sooths or SoS, but he hasn't been here in a while. I consider him a true expert on the numerology and symbolism of MT as I'm sure those who have read some of his past comments here will agree. He is way ahead of anyone else when it comes to MT.
I was encouraging research into MT because I’ve tended to avoid studying it’s details, and I’ve noticed more discussion recently about some aspects of the document. Bessler thought that someone might find a way to the solution by studying the drawings.
DeleteI don’t know where SoS has gone but I did enjoy most of his comments even if I was doubtful sometimes, about his conclusions.
JC
@JC
DeleteAnonymous27 September 2022 at 12:10 = Sayer of Sooths = SoS = Ken Behrendt
"The only guy I know who's done any serious research into MT is Sayer of Sooths... He is way ahead of anyone else when it comes to MT"
The self-praise here is nauseatingly obvious.
Hey, anon 20:14. I'm sure that Ken B would appreciate your comment which is a nice review for his book, but I recognize that comment. I think it was originally posted on this blog about a year or so ago. All that your reposting of it now will do is get John all worked up and then it will be difficult for him to keep his commitment to having a new and more tolerant philosophy toward the different opinions that others have about how Bessler's wheels worked. You reposting that long comment now is like inviting an ex alcoholic to a wine tasting party or someone on a strict diet to a pizza party! Please have mercy on John at this time as he struggles to adjust to his new pm philosophy.
Delete@Anonymous27 September 2022 at 20:32
DeleteHey, leave Ken B alone, he want to come here and post somes thing, let him come, he no harm no body, if John no like he comment, he can delete he comment, if Ken B want reposts somes thing he say year ago, that his thing, let him alone, we all somes time repost same old comments, like John do when he say he will make a working wheel very soon...
"get John all worked up"
DeleteLOL! If it makes him get his wheel finished sooner, that's a good thing.
I doubt if that was Ken B who reposted that old comment, anon 20:44. He's no longer active as a Bessler researcher and has moved on to other things. He published a non Bessler science book back in February and I just found out that he published another one last May! He must spend all of his time writing books so I don't see how he could have any left over to hang around here and post anonymously.
DeleteI realized a while ago that Ken B's "disciples" don't really care if his design is ever turned into a working wheel. The thought that it might be someday is sufficient for them. As far as they are concerned the solution has now been found and it's in Ken's "holy book" that anon 20:14 reposted a previous old comment about above.
DeleteSomeone a few blogs ago said Ken created a new religion for them and I agree. As in all religions, for those who have the faith need no proof is necessary and for those outsiders who lack the faith no proof is sufficient. Ken's disciples obviously now have the faith and no longer really need any proof. Part of me envies them because I don't have that faith yet. Maybe after seeing my own efforts keep failing for a few more years, I too will finally "see the light" and become one of his disciples? I guess anything is possible.
Ken B posted a bizarre cartoon he made when he left bwf years ago. It showed him levitating, Jesus-like up into a heavenly realm where only successful Bessler researchers would be found. That was probably his way to saying he was very serious about finding a solution and he believed destined to do so. Then incredibly over a decade later and in 2019 when he was trying to market his new Bessler wheel book, he was emailing out another cartoon he made showing himself floating down from that realm and holding his book above his head like he was Moses coming down from Mount Sinai with the tablets containing the Ten Commandments! I used to have links to those two cartoons, but cannot find them now. But they should leave no doubt as to the religious nature of his Bessler pm wheel research. Maybe he was not aware of that religious symbolism when he made them?
Bessler also tried to establish his own universal Orffyrean church and even published a book about what his religious beliefs were. John never had an English translation made of that book and it's rarely mentioned, but I think it would make fascinating reading especially if it mentions his thoughts about pm.
@anon 00:28
DeleteI found Ken's "Return" cartoon in one of my folders:
https://i.postimg.cc/x8JcQrDS/Ken-s-Return.jpg
The comments by the "confused, frustrated mobilists" below him are funny and sound all too familiar. I agree that it definitely has some religious symbolism in it.
Let’s face it, we have all the information we are ever gonna get, so why not keep trying to find the answer in all the stuff we have got!?
ReplyDeleteThere's no way to know that for sure. It's better to keep digging just in case there's something really important that we've missed so far. I was about to give up on MT until SoS started showing up here and opened my eyes as to what's really in there.
Deletehttps://i.postimg.cc/NjD8YSCC/besslerrev13.jpg
ReplyDeleteMy latest version of the ??theOne$$ featuring 12 levers, 12 yellow launching weights and 5 red flying weights. The aim is to maximize the net torque in favor of the descending side. I further modified the zigzagging blue guides posted in the last blog. A yellow weight now free falls three times along the guide on the ascending side during rotation, and three yellow weights falls simultaneously at each moment. This means that the ascending side possesses less than half the torque of the descending side during that brief moment (the falling weights in midair are not part of the wheel.) The 6:00 weight free falls as well to cause the descending side to be momentarily lighter by 1 weight. To prevent this a connecting ramp is added to the bottom of the guide so that the weight just rolls onto it at 6:00.
Water Nymph:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ix4niQ-qL6c
Wouldn't it be very noisy with all of those four pound weights bouncing along those stepped ramps? If that was B's design, he would have had to hand out earplugs to people during his wheel demonstrations!
Delete@ 21:11, Bessler's wheeld were noisy! I think he padded the inside of one of the wheels to lessen the sound.
DeleteDoes anyone have any information on the glass perpetuum mobile wheel made in 1909? It was published in the November edition of Popular Mechanics.
ReplyDeletePage 546
Delete"Perpetual Motion" Advertising Novelty: Motion Machine That Interests the Public
Thousands of people have watched this presumed perpetual motion machine whirl in store windows where it has been displayed as a means of drawing attention, but none of them so far have guessed what makes it go. Nothing like a wire, magnet, or motor can be found anywhere about it, yet the glass balls keep revolving, ceaselessly, day and night. To prove perfect insulation from outside forces the glass balls revolves on a glass axle under a glass bell, on a glass plate, supported by wine glasses, but the inventor is an electrician.
Is that a 6 or a 9 printed on those glass balls?
DeleteI'm not sure anon, but there seems to be four legs coming off the axle, each of which forms a fork to three glass balls, for a total of 12 in the wheel. My main question is, with all that glass, where are the weights? I don't think the numbers on the balls are of any importance, probably just to show the glass ball clearly.
DeleteI disagree with you, the article says the inventor is an electrician, which means that there was not necessarily any weights. Everything was glass which is an electrical dielectric, and those printed numbers were probably conductive ink, allowing static electric charges to be stored temporarily on the glass ball capacitors, and released by the conductive numbers at certain intervals, to attract at one stage and repel at another, thus making a motor.
Delete@anon 20:18
DeleteYou can try digging around in these archived copies of the 1909 editions of Popular Mechanics and you might find the article you are looking for:
https://archive.org/details/PopularMechanics1909/Popular_Mechanics_01_1909/
Good luck and if you do find it please post a link to it here so others can check it out.
PM Dreamer
https://archive.org/details/PopularMechanics1909/Popular_Mechanics_11_1909/page/n37/mode/2up
DeleteIt's also in Google books, Nov 1909, p.546
There's a very simple explanation for how this "pm" device works which I'm surprised no one realizes yet. I'll let you ponder it a while longer before I reveal it.
DeleteOf course, anon, he filled the glass with gas, it heats up on one side (getting lighter) and cools down on the other (gets heavier), creating an imbalance.
Delete@anon 23:21
DeleteNope
@anon 23:46
DeleteYup
FINALLY!!!
ReplyDeleteBESSLER'S SECRET HAS BEEN DISCOVERED!!!
Here is a gif animation showing the inside of the wheel in action:
https://media3.giphy.com/media/EUKWawNC65oc0/600w.gif
Impossible! The first mention of the Syrian hamster was in 1797, when physician Alexander Russell came across them in the wild and described the rodents in a publication called The Natural History of Aleppo. Bessler died in 1745.
DeleteCould have been "a cat scratching inside" as someone claimed...
Deletehttp://c.tenor.com/LUFxQeZ6AAQAAAAC/cat-run.gif
In a game of cat and mouse, my bet is on the cat!
DeleteMaybe 10 copies.
ReplyDeleteJeff
https://orka.bibliothek.uni-kassel.de/viewer/image/1557307070403/
ReplyDeletehttps://orka.bibliothek.uni-kassel.de/viewer/image/1557307070403/61/
ReplyDeleteJeff
Both the above files are in Orffyreana collection and I have copies of all of them, amounting to more than 600 pages but largely illegible, to me at least.
DeleteJC
https://www.cambridge.org/core/books/abs/correspondence-of-isaac-newton/1418-j-c-f-von-hatzfeld-to-newton-1723-or-1724/033F06F873EE6630DD312A8934AD65FA
ReplyDeletehttps://1.bp.blogspot.com/-w12BuRVPPmk/XmTr5X0bpMI/AAAAAAAAFg8/mMicZNbgZI4PWgclFnMoRtcVMsOUkM_ygCEwYBhgL/s640/100EED06-C6BB-4EA2-9140-69EA8E8DEDAF.jpeg
ReplyDeleteI have both the above files too. Von Hatzfeld was regarded as an obsessed nuisance and was ignored.
DeleteJC
@John MT142 & MT143 aren't included in the total ?
Delete@JB. The Toys page is numbered 138,139,140 and 141, which I take to mean it replaces those original drawings and is therefore the end.
DeleteMT 142 and MT 143 seem like hand drawn images which seem as though Bessler sketching idea but not actual physical objects.
JC
@JC
DeleteWould you mind publishing links to whatever you have on Von Hatzfeld? He claimed to know Orffyre's secret but wouldn't reveal the whole wheel, just little bits and pieces here and there. Just because everybody ignored him doesn't mean he didn't have anything important to disclose. A lot of people ignored Bessler too, and we all know his wheel was genuine.
Yes the secret is there in MT, but for whatever reason no one has really investigated something that is shown there, if anyone did they would have it. DS
ReplyDeleteI saw mention of MT clues here so I guess I should make some comments on the subject since I've been away for a while and also in gratitude for the very nice things that were said about me above by anon 27 September 2022 at 12:10. Thanks!
Delete@anon10:54
Most of the secrets of Bessler's wheels are in MT as you say. Finding them, however, will push an analyst's abilities to their maximum limit. I know because they have had me at that limit for some time.
Basically, I found that Bessler put ALL of the important specific details of his wheels into the Toys Page and the general details of his wheels into SOME of the remaining drawings of his previously unpublished MT book. Unfortunately, one must be a numerologist and a very skilled one at that to find them. They will be as unintelligible as ancient Greek to anyone who lacks that skill. Fortunately, I happen to have that skill and can usually translate even complex numerological coding into a form that anyone can easily understand as I hope I've demonstrated on this blog in the past.
I recently made an amazing discovery about one of the non Toys Page MT drawings which completely changed my analysis of it. I'm rushing to get out the door right now and don't have time to give all of the details in this short comment. Let's just say that I've found that practically all of us have been MISLED about one of the most important drawings in MT! I don't think it was done on purpose, however. It was just a mishap and when I return, I'll try to correct that mistake. Get ready for a surprise!
Sayer of Sooths
Welcome back SoS.
DeleteJC
Maybe only 5
DeleteJeff
I was studying the Toys page of MT. I believe it represents the mechanism of Bessler's bi-directional wheel as it shows two pantographs in opposite movements (the bottom figures have twisted bodies that hint at chirality). To see if the Toys page contains any relevance to my concept ??theOne$$ I made a side-by-side comparison. I believe there is:
Deletehttps://i.postimg.cc/g0H4J11L/besslerrev14.jpg
The double-beam design of the pantographs resembles my lever's two arms carrying the yellow and red weights. The twisted bodies of the bottom one could also hint at the use of a spring. The Jacob's ladder A implies upward motion like my flying red weights. It is also said that A symbolizes the linkage of parts or even "connectedness" principle, which I can see in the ??theOne$$. B resembles my "V" lever with the blue guide below. One side of the storks-bill E looks like the zigzag guide. Of course who can forget the number 5 (John Bessler's favorite) on the lower right of the page. The outline of ??theOne$$ double-arm lever with the guide does look like a 5.
Am I delusional? You decide.
"Am I delusional? You decide."
DeleteMost likely yes. But don't feel too bad about that because so are about 999 out of 1,000 Bessler pm wheel chasers. Bessler's clues are so subtle and so easy to miss that only a rare few will be able to find them and accurately interpret them. He made it that way deliberately, of course.
"Unfortunately, one must be a numerologist and a very skilled one at that to find them. They will be as unintelligible as ancient Greek to anyone who lacks that skill. Fortunately, I happen to have that skill and can usually translate even complex numerological coding into a form that anyone can easily understand as I hope I've demonstrated on this blog in the past."
DeleteDon't take this personal , I always thought your interpretations were more or less on the same level of hogwash as KB's , but that's just my opinion , maybe your nuts maybe your not , hard to tell .
I'm just not one for this type of conjure.
Continuing with my study of the Toys page, let's focus on the two pantographs C and D and how they relate to ??theOne$$ concept. Each pantograph is labeled the same twice meaning there are two subparts of each entity. Likewise ??theOne$$ double-arm lever carries a flying red weight and a launching yellow weight that move separately during rotation. Pantograph C shows the left figure hammering down the anvil. The downward motion is suggestive of the downward swing of the lever. He looks heavier and is the yellow weight. The right figure looks lighter and wears a downturn hat. He is the subordinate and is the red weight (aka cannon fodder).
DeletePantograph D shows the reverse movement and is the reverse lever of a bi-directional wheel. The right figure hammering down looks heavier with a longer body (tightly wrapped to the post) and hair and is the yellow weight. The left figure looks lighter (shorter body and hair) and wears a downturn hat. He is the subordinate and is the red weight. Further the curved shape of their hammers may hint at the flight trajectories of the weight.
You decide...
"Don't take this personal , I always thought your interpretations were more or less on the same level of hogwash as KB's"
DeleteThat's because "Sayer of Sooths" IS Ken Behrendt...
Didn't JC say that the important figures were in DT, that were referenced by the introductory note to MT, and not actually the figures in MT itself???
Delete@Anonymous28 September 2022 at 23:28
DeleteBeing that the intro note to MT is an intro note to MT, wouldn't it stand to reason that it is trying to be an intro note to MT?
Just where do you think DT fits into all that any more than GB or AP?
Hi anon 23:29, I was only pointing out that JC had mentioned that the figures in DT held all the clues, and MT just shows a bunch of non-runners, that's all.
Delete@Anonymous28 September 2022 at 23:29
DeleteBessler had stated in one of his books that the first 50 pictures in his so-called "book full of machines I was grinding out" contained the "movement" among them, and that the other 100 or so were just there to show other things he tinkered with but had nothing to do with his wheel. I find it fascinating that he only includes written notes to the first 50 figures or so, and then leaves the remaining 100 blank. Some at the end he didn't even number. This then narrows down the figures to look at.
Thanks for the welcome, JC. Also, once again for about the dozenth time that I've had to state this since arriving here years ago, I am not KB! You people seem obsessed with him for some reason which I assume is connected with his claim that he finally successfully reverse engineered Bessler's wheels. I may have more to say about that matter later.
DeleteMany know that I've specialized in the MT drawings and found them to contain some really amazing and previously unknown clues. One of them was that "Lucky Ratio" clue I found last year and which gave the locations of the lever pivots in Bessler's wheels. I was happy to see others also finding that special ratio in the Bessler drawings even though, unfortunately, most of their comments were deleted for some reason. I consider that clue to be strong evidence that Bessler's wheels did contain levers which had weights attached to their ends.
The most important drawing I have found in MT outside of the Toys Page is MT13 which is notable for several reasons. In its note Bessler tells us it would make an excellent overbalanced type wheel if he could only get the levers approaching 12:00 to quickly rise. I am firmly convinced that the final working wheel design Bessler invented was basically a variation of MT13.
I say this because MT13 actually contains the most numerology pertaining to religion of anything he ever drew! Recall that he was absolutely convinced he only found a working pm wheel because of a miracle granted to him by God. It would only be natural for him to praise that God in the drawing most similar to his actually final working wheel that God miraculously allowed him to find. Also, I'm impressed that MT13 contains a smiling face! Why a happy face like that? Simple, it was his way of telling us that if we can correctly modify that wheel design, it will eventually make us happy by allowing us to find a working wheel design!
But, I'm not here to discuss MT13 in this blog, but rather another drawing which also stands out. I'm referring to MT10 whose note tells us:
"The principle is good, but the figure is not yet complete until I delineate it much differently at the appropriate place and indicate the correct handle construction."
This design's principle being good simply means that it could stay out of balance as it turned if there weren't some problems with it. Those problems apparently have to do with the incorrect shape of its curved "handles" or actually weight holding levers and how they are arranged inside of the wheel. Bessler tells us he will give us the correct lever shape and their arrangement "at the appropriate place" by which he meant at the end of MT where he intended to supply several detailed drawings that showed the actual final design of his working wheels.
Unfortunately, fate had different plans and those end of MT drawings were destroyed and then replaced by the Toys Page instead. But, matters could have been worse. He could have destroyed all of the drawings in MT! I'm convinced that the Toys Page actually contains all of the information in it in numerological form that was contained in the removed and destroyed drawings in graphical form. Extracting that information, however, requires a lot of numerological analysis and is an ongoing project for me.
This comment is starting to get a bit too lengthy now so I'll have to continue it in my next comment here tomorrow and then reveal how we've all been subtly misled by MT10 for years. Stay tuned everyone!
Sayer of Sooths
SoS wrote: "I was happy to see others also finding that special ratio in the Bessler drawings even though, unfortunately, most of their comments were deleted for some reason."
DeleteHi, SoS. I remember that incident because a comment I made then was one of the those that got "deleted for some reason". I was not too happy about that.
I thought he was delusional about that Bessler lucky ratio he claimed he had found in MT and decided to check it out for myself. It didn't take me long to find it in the drawing of the Kassel wheel in DT that shows it running the water pump. Look at the left side of that drawing and carefully measure the distance from the center of the wheel's axle up to the elevation of the pendulum's horizontal rod. Next carefully measure the distance from the center of the axle up to the rim of the drum. If you then divide the smaller distance by the larger distance you measured, you will discover that it's very close to 0.77 (the actual value of the ratio is 0.777... which is an unending number). Others whose comments got deleted along with mine also reported finding that same ratio in some of Bessler's other drawings. SoS claims that ratio gives you the distance from the center of a wheel's axle to where Bessler placed the steel pivots inside the drum to which the lever's were attached and around which they swung.
For example, in a 12 feet diameter drum, the radius will be 6 feet. To find out where the pivots were located, convert 6 feet into 72 inches. Next, multiply that radius by the lucky ratio or 72 inches x 0.777... and get exactly 56 inches. Since the drum is 72 inches in radius, that means a lever whose pivot is at a distance of 56 inches from the center of the axle cannot be longer than 16 inches or it will hit the inside curving surface of the drum's rim as the lever swings around the pivot during the rotation of the drum.
I think that SoS's lucky ratio is a valid clue and at least gives us the maximum size of one of the levers used in Bessler's 12 feet diameter wheels. Assuming that Bessler used the same proportions in all of his wheel's drums, then the lever pivots in, for example, a 6 feet diameter wheel whose radius is 36 inches would be located at a distance of 28 inches from the center of its axle and the levers could not be any longer than 8 inches.
I'm looking forward to seeing any future MT clues SoS can share with us.
jason
18
Delete@ Jason. I’m sorry if your comment disappeared, but it was not my doing. If you can give me an idea when or which blog it appeared I can check back because only the other day a comment vanished, but when I checked and it was still in the comment folder and I just republished it and it appeared in the right place.
I only delete comments containing bad language or those promoting Ken’s book. I only delete that because I know for a fact that it is full of errors and unacceptable conclusions.
JC
@jason if he used levers they could have been connected anywhere he needed them with any length he needed them to be , even at the center to the rim , how on earth can someone say 1+1 =2 so there must be 2 weights.
DeleteJohn wrote "I only delete comments containing bad language or those promoting Ken’s book. I only delete that because I know for a fact that it is full of errors and unacceptable conclusions."
DeleteI think John is suffering from some memory loss concerning that past event. He actually deleted about FORTY comments back then made by people here who were intrigued by SoS's Lucky Ratio discovery and those deletions WERE definitely John's doing. I don't recall anyone mentioning Ken B or his book in any of those comments and there was no bad language in any of them either.
I think that the REAL reason John got rid of those comments was because that new clue wasn't discovered by HIM and since its implications didn't happen to agree with HIS ideas about Bessler's wheels at that time, his elitist pm philosophy required him to get rid of them and the hell with those who probably spent hours of effort to share their little discoveries with others on this blog which is supposed to be why it's here and not just to stroke John's ego by agreeing with everything that he CLAIMS to "know for a fact" about Bessler's wheels. I wonder how many of those posters who got their comments deleted back then left vowing never to come back here again and lost any interest they had in Bessler's wheels as a result?
Everyone might now think that John has suddenly changed his old elitist pm philosophy in the last few blogs and would never do anything like that again. Lol! Remember that old saying "A leopard doesn't change its spots". As more and more other possible solutions to Bessler's wheels are presented on this blog in the future (hopefully!) that don't "mimic" or closely match the design that he "knows for a fact" is Bessler's design (assuming that he actually has found any design at all!), I have no doubt that he'll be right back to deleting them again before you all know it and hoping that nobody notices. Watch and see how right I am about that.
I don’t know why you would say that Anon 15:04! I haven’t deleted 40 comments in the full nine years of this blog.
DeletePerhaps SoS would like to confirm your accusations?
JC
I do remember that incident, John. It happened, IIRC, during the late spring or early summer of last year when you deleted about forty comments that were posted by people in response to SoS's then latest MT clue revelation here which involved that "lucky ratio" he found.
DeleteYou must have really ticked off a lot of people because shortly afterwards I noticed that the number of comments on this blog dropped way down and it stayed that way for months until around the beginning of the holidays when it started to come back again. For a while I actually thought it was going to be the end of this blog! Blogs all over the web are dying every day when their regulars stop posting on them for some reason.
Then around Christmas SoS popped in and provided us with one of his numerological analyses of something else in MT, but instead of welcoming him back you started insulting his methods! He took that personally and promptly left saying he might never return again. Fortunately, about three or four months later and early this year he had cooled off enough and came back.
You acted like you couldn't care less about all of the people whose comments you so casually pulled the flush lever on because you figured no one would even notice or complain about what you did. It seemed like because people were discussing a new clue here that you didn't discover, you considered them to be like your personal enemies!
I'm sorry, but I find myself agreeing with those that say you have a big ego problem when it comes to Bessler's wheels and that your "elitist pm philosophy" is the way you express it. Until you actually have a working wheel spinning away nonstop in your workshop, your opinions about how Bessler's wheels may have worked aren't any better than anyone else's here no matter how much you might want to believe they are.
Maybe this blog comment section from his Thursday, 13 May 2021 blog titled "Johann Bessler's Hidden Codes - Golden Ratio (phi) and MT 137" will help to jog John's foggy memory? It's the one where he deleted the 40 comments after SoS revealed that "Bessler Lucky Ratio" clue he found in MT as a two part comment there on 16 May 2021 at 04:02.
Deletehttps://johncollinsnews.blogspot.com/2021/05/johann-besslers-hidden-codes-golden.html#comment-form
Those 40 comments were obviously made during a ONE WEEK long gap in the comments section that appears between 18 May 2021 and 27 May 2021 when, at time 08:52, John finally returns and writes:
"Yes I’ve deleted all comments inspired by Ken’s ridiculous book. I am mighty suspicious that there are so many comments apparently supporting his imaginary clues and I suspect the author of most of them is Ken."
Apparently, because he "suspected" that all 40 comments might have been made to support Ken B's book or wheel design without any actual proof of that, that justified him deleting a week's worth of people's comments on this blog! The idea that he might actually have believed they were all made by a single person, Ken B, is ridiculous when you think about it.
When people like anon 18:52 started complaining that he deleted their comments which were about the Lucky Ratio SoS found and had NOTHING to do with Ken B, his Bessler book, or his wheel design, John's lame response on 27 May 2021 at 19:17 was:
"I understand your point anon, 18.52, and I’d love to explain why I dismiss it so easily but I don’t want to publish any of my work yet. I can tell you that the ‘.7777’ discovery is no such thing. The actual siting of the pivots is well established and I will explain due course, how and why I know this for a fact."
It's been well over a year now and we're still all patiently waiting for John's explanation of how he knows "for a fact" that Bessler's Lucky Ratio can't possibly be real and where exactly those "well established" locations of a wheel's lever pivots are. Good thing we weren't all holding our breaths while we were waiting!
I also believe that what happened back then in May of 2021 was all due to John's delusional belief that ONLY his clues count and he has to make sure no one sees any other credible ones that might actually challenge the validity of his clues. Since he never actually shows us those clues he claims to have, the design they lead to, or anything that would support whatever those and would prove what he sporadically claims here, all he can do is hit the delete button to relieve his envy whenever he sees anyone else's Bessler research getting a little too much attention here. For me, his continuing secrecy makes me wonder if he actually does have any clues and a credible wheel design based on them or if he doesn't currently have them, but is hoping he will eventually find them someday. If that's the case then his secrecy becomes more understandable.
I'm hoping that anon 15:04 is wrong and that we've finally seen the last of John's elitist pm philosophy at work here. Time will tell...
Still transparent, pathetic, and sad. A blog with 48 followers and we're stuck with Ken and his fragile ego. Grow the fuck up, dude.
DeleteSorry in advance John,
Jeff
I'm not still angry about what happened, but I can personally verify that my comment on that May 2021 blog along with many others was deleted. I never mentioned Ken B, his book, or his wheel and I don't recall anyone else doing that either. We were all too busy looking for examples in Bessler's drawings where he might have used that lucky ratio that SoS found and pointed out to us and some of us, myself included, were actually finding it.
DeleteI never use any foul language in my comments and I am not Ken B. John never apologized to anyone back then for deleting their comments and he never restored any of the deleted comments. Those are the facts of what actually happened back then and I have no reason to lie about any of them.
jason
Hmm...John seems to be suffering from a rare condition known as "PCDA" or "Post Comment Deletion Amnesia" which makes blog owners unable to remember any past comments they've deleted even if they've deleted dozens of them at a time!
DeleteAnon 27 September 2022 at 20:33 posted a clip of a hamster inside a moving wheel experiencing a mishap:
ReplyDeletehttps://media3.giphy.com/media/EUKWawNC65oc0/600w.gif
When the hamster slipped it was lifted upward and later flung out. What caused this lift? It was the radial acceleration expressed by
a = v^2/r (v=tangential velocity of the wheel, r=radius)
This got me thinking about the forces acting inside a spinning wheel. All parts are subject to the vertical pull of gravity and the pull of radial acceleration as the wheel turns. In ??theOne$$ concept the 6:00 red flying weight is also subject to a third force of the unwound spring. There is a net upward lift from the spring and radial acceleration at the moment the weight is launched. If the radial acceleration is sufficient the ejected weight can in fact be heavier, at least as heavy as the yellow weight! Then this fits the Bessler statements:
"A great craftsman is he who can lightly cause a heavy weight to fly upwards! Who can make 4 pounds rise as 1 pound falls. One pound can cause the raising of more than one pound..." AP 291
"Even Wagner will have heard that one pound can cause the raising of more than one pound. He writes that, to date, no one has ever found a mechanical arrangement sufficient for the required task..." AP 330
If so, the heavier figures of the pantographs in the MT Toys page are in fact the red flying weights, not the yellow ones that I originally thought!
Thanks Anon 20:33 for the insightful clip!
I wasn't satisfied with my last post explaining Bessler's clue about one pound falling and four pounds shooting up. I jumped the gun on this one. It was based off a hamster video clip a reader had linked. After reviewing other videos of animals running inside wheels, it appears they are tossed in the direction of the moving wheel when they lose their traction. The hamster however flies in the opposite direction. This could be a video manipulation or possibley optical illusion (eg, wagon-wheel effect). I offered another explanation in a prior blog which I also found unsatisfactory.
DeleteSo we now arrive at the most sensible explanation I believe (lol). Suppose you have a 12-lever wheel with 5 flying red weights. A weight after landing on the 2:00 lever naturally descends toward 5:00. The distance from 2:00 to 5:00 constitutes a quarter of a circle. During its descent this weight indirectly and successively launches the four leading weights approaching 6:00 back up to the 2:00 position. The process matches the translation:
"He will be called a great craftsman, who can easily/lightly throw a heavy thing high, and if/when one pound falls a quarter, it shoots four pounds up four quarters high. Who on this can speculate, will soon the motion perpetuate, Who however does not yet know this, all that hard work/industry is in vain." AP 291 Stewart translation
https://i.postimg.cc/GtgjR9Nd/besslerrev16.jpg
https://www.blogger.com/profile/13935544689027611309
ReplyDeletehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13274781515636883957
Are both john collins on there you JC?
Yes that’s me.
DeleteJC
Part 1 of 2:
ReplyDeleteI'm back with another installment which hopefully will open everyone's eyes a little further when it comes to the many clues, especially numerological ones, that Bessler hid in his MT drawings. I'm posting it down here in a new thread because the one I originally posted it in above started to go off on a tangent about past events which, although unfortunate, really have little to do with my latest MT research that I'm trying to present now.
In this installment, however, and taking a cue from others here who are doing likewise recently, I have an image I made to show everyone that I uploaded to postimages.org (this is a first for me!) and which I suggest a reader open in a separate tab so he can study it as he reads through this comment:
https://postimg.cc/ThkVLdqP
On the left side you will see the "redrawn" version of MT10 which was done by some artist for a website called orffyre.com. It is all over the web and usually the only one referred to when discussing MT10. It's also the only one any who have never seen the original version in Bessler's MT10 know about. On the right side I show the original version of MT10 from Bessler's previously unpublished collection of drawings.
You might wonder that since they are identical, why should anyone care whether he is seeing the redrawn version or the original version? Shouldn't he prefer the redrawn one because it's neater? But, are they really identical?
No, they are not! If you take the time to compare the two versions side by side and count the curved levers in each one carefully, you will discover that the redrawn version has 16 levers while the original version only has 15 levers! Your natural reaction to that discrepancy may be that Bessler obviously messed up his drawing and the artist for orffyre.com was kind enough to correct Bessler's mistake for him. How nice of him. You may believe that Bessler was just tired and got confused when he drew the original MT10 and with all of those curved levers crowded together on the wheel's ascending side, anyone could make a mistake like that. Poor Bessler...he must have had vision problems of some sort from all of those thick books on mechanics he spent so many hours at night reading by lamp light.
No. Bessler did not make a mistake when he drew MT10 with only 15 levers instead of a more symmetrical 16 levers in it as shown in the redrawn version. There are VERY few actual mistakes in Bessler's drawings and this is not one of them. He deliberately placed only two levers instead of the three into that left quadrant of the original MT10 to attract the attention of future analysts to that particular design for some purpose. I've concluded that purpose was because the original MT10 contains some very important information, numerologically encoded into the design, about the actual lever shapes Bessler used in his wheels which were not curved.
Sayer of Sooths
(continued and concluded in Part 2 of 2)
Part 2 of 2:
DeleteImo, the redrawn version of MT10, if accepted as being what Bessler really intended his original MT10 drawing to look like, will completely ruin all of the numerological clues that Bessler purposely hid in his original version. However, please note that I'm not trying to suggest that this was done on purpose because the artist would have been unaware of what he was doing by redrawing Bessler's original MT10. At this point I'm sure many reading this will say "What numerological clues? I don't see any of them." Let me explain here briefly all of the numbers that are really involved with the original version of MT10.
First, there is the ordinal number of the drawing itself which is 10. Next is the quantity of curved levers which is 15 (and not 16!). We then have 4 of the levers attached to the inner wheel where its 4 radial members attach it to the axle. 3 of the 4 quadrants located between the radial members contain 3 lever pivots each, while the remaining left side quadrant contains only 2 lever pivots instead of 3 (and is the reason that the original version only has a total of 15 levers instead of 16 as shown in the redrawn version that puts 3 lever pivots into that left side quadrant in order to "fix up" Bessler's drawing "mistake" for him!).
But, take a look at those 4 radial members attached to the axle. They can be thought of as a wrap around collection of four "V" letters that are touching each other. Bessler liked to represent the number 5 by using the Roman numeral "V", so those four "V" letters represent four number 5's.
Also take note of the four radial members themselves. They can be thought of as forming a letter "X" which is the Roman numeral for 10. They can also represent either an addition or "+" sign or a multiplication or "x" sign. They tell us that Bessler wants us to do some simple arithmetical manipulations of the various numbers that come out of his original version of MT10.
Oh, and don't forget that lone dot in the center of the wheel's axle. Yes, it's an axle pivot, but in numerological analysis it also stands for a decimal point which here tells us that we might have to manipulate the location of decimal points in any numerological results we derive in order to finally obtain some information about the exact shapes of the levers that Bessler hid in his original version of MT10.
To summarize, from the preceding we see that Bessler has provided us with the numbers 2, 3, 4, 5, 10, and 15 in his original version of MT10 and directed us to use both addition and multiplication operations on them, after perhaps moving a decimal point around, so we can then find some important information about the shapes of the final working levers he used in his pm wheels. Perhaps we should consider doing what he obviously tells us to do with those numbers?
Well, that's exactly what I intend to start doing in my next installment here. Please continue to stay tuned everyone!
Sayer of Sooths
(conclusion of Part 2 of 2)
Nobody gives a hot damn about your clues Ken.
DeleteJeff
@SoS
Delete! never thought that mt 10 drawing that used to be on bwf was not accurate. Thanks for pointing that out which makes me wonder how accurate the rest of those redone mt drawings are.
Thanks for another great MT revelation, SoS. You never fail to deliver something surprising when you show up here. This one is truly a bit of a shocker. It sort of proves that old saying "The road to hell is paved with good intentions". By helping to correct Bessler's supposedly poorly drawn MT 10 wheel design, he wiped out its value for accurate numerology analysis. Errors like that can hold back progress with the wheels by years until they are corrected as you just did.
DeleteBut, otoh, his orffyre.com is an otherwise very informative site devoted to Bessler and definitely worth a visit by anyone who hasn't seen it yet. It's the only place where you can read some of the letters written about Bessler by others for free without having to buy a book to do so.
Hmm...the 16th lever is missing and that was done on purpose. Did anyone notice that if you add the digits in 16 together you get 1 + 6 = 7? That's the luckiest number of all in numerology! Maybe Bessler arranged it that way to tell us that if we could correctly interpret the clues he hid in MT 10, then we would get very lucky like he did when God helped him make a working pm wheel? What could be luckier than learning how he build his pm wheels?!
DeleteI don't know much , but let's see these clues and numbers produce a "working wheel" now that you know about them , of course if it can not , then it's not clues as claimed.
Delete@JB
DeleteEven if one knows the exact lever shape Bessler used, there will still be a lot more he will need to accurately know to coordinate those levers so that, as the drum rotates and they begin swinging around their pivots, their collective center of gravity remains floating on the drum's descending side. If that does not happen, then one can have no pm. There's a good reason that Bessler wrote this in AP:
"It took a tremendous amount of calculation before I was able to devise this machine! It took a great deal of time before it was all properly figured out!"
Agreed , what ever the principles were , they must have had a solid mathematical and physics foundation , which according to him were deeply hidden yet simple to understand once revealed.
DeletePlenty of people have seen and discussed the odd levers and spacing in MT10 on BW.com. If you spent the pocket change and bought JCs MT, or look in orffyreanna, you are free to see the original. I see no revelation here. Also, there are plenty of drawings with mistakes, purposeful or accidental, you can theorise as you like.
DeleteT79
@T79 our old news , looks like discoveries here , the forum seems to be ahead.
Delete@T79
DeleteI thank SoS for bringing this to our attention whether it's for the first time or if "plenty of people" over on bwf supposedly knew about it once and then forgot all about it. JC below sounds like he didn't know about it and he used to live over on bwf pushing his books there. Also SoS is the only one to tell us why Bessler left that lever out and what its real meaning is. Those plenty of people over on bwf would have been clueless about that and unless they come here they will stay that way. SoS is ahead of bwf on this one imo.
We would rather stay clueless on this one. :)
Delete@anon12:40
DeleteImo SoS should be publishing his MT insights in a book instead of just releasing them here a few at a time every couple of months or so to eventually be lost like all of those thousands of images over on bwf recently were when some "upgrade" comes along or a host goes out of business. Books last. Blogs and websites don't.
Why not , there are multiple people who author what they think are important negative and positive findings , everyone is free to do as they please.
DeleteI'm not in to the whole number counting and such , but who cares , I do me , everyone else do them.
The artist SoS mentioned who redrew the MT10 is a long time correspondent of mine and we were part of a Bessler research team back in the dim and distant past. He is a graphic designer as well as excellent researcher in this field and posts on BW forum as ovyyus.
ReplyDeleteJC
What was the reaction of the rest of your team when you saw that the ovyyus version of mt 10 wasn't the same as the one Bessler made? It's hard to believe no one noticed.
DeleteThere hasn’t been time for response, Bill lives in Tasmania.
DeleteJC
The secret must be in MT because he said as much as you quoted. He didn’t say a movement could be found in any other writings or portraits. If the guys on BWF keep musing they’ll be the first to stumble on a movement.
DeleteJeff
@JC
DeleteAny news from Tasmania yet? Is he still alive? Was you aware of the extra lever he added to mt10 or in the dark like the rest of us?
No news yet and I didn’t know about the extra lever.
DeleteJC
When it comes to MT10, I think it's doubtful that Bessler would have written such a long explanatory note on its proof print if he didn't consider the drawing to show exactly what he wanted it to show. There are minor errors in Bessler's other MT drawings, but nothing as glaring as the missing 16th lever in MT10. I also believe like SoS does that the 16th lever that should have been in MT10 was left out on purpose by Bessler to direct our attention to that particular drawing because it contains some important clues for us.
ReplyDeleteI don't agree but that is my prerogative , you go ahead and agree.
ReplyDelete"However, I have left all demonstrations and experiments, since it would be difficult for anybody to see or learn anything about a perpetual motion from them or to decide whether there was any truth in them because no illustration by itself contains a description of the motion; however, taking various illustrations together and combining them with a discerning mind, it will indeed be possible to look for a movement and, finally to find one in them."
ReplyDeleteIf we were to take Bessler's above statement at face value, the most important aspect to look for in the MT wheel drawings is the movement of the weights. As these (tethered) designs are all failures, any clue unrelated to movement holds less significance I would say. One may possibly be going down the rabbit hole in that case. I wanted to see if my ??theOne$$ concept corresponds to any of the movement in the drawings. The concept features two separate movements -- one of the yellow weights and one of the red weights. The essence of the pm motion in the ??theOne$$ is the red weights circulating on the descending side.
Most of the movements in the first 50 or so MT drawings are similar to that of the yellow weights. MT 5 and MT 11 show double movement albeit of the yellows. However, only one in particular is similar to the reds. It's MT 48:
https://i.postimg.cc/NLhQsKDm/besslerrev17.jpg
If I were you mryy, I would skip all of the fancy zigzagging blue ramp wheels you are designing one after another and just keep it as simple as possible. Go back to your original four or six curving ramp, one direction wheel design and try to make a working sim for that wheel. If you can't do that, then what hope would you have to make anything more complex work? If you can make it work, then you can slowly try to make that one more powerful and even two directional if you want to.
DeleteA lot of newbie simmers get their first experience with simming by using the Algodoo simulation program. It's super easy to use and you can get a free download of it from their website here:
http://www.algodoo.com/
Part 1 of 2:
ReplyDeleteOkay, now that everyone's been properly prepared, it's time to role up our sleeves and do some serious numerological analysis of MT10. We will be working with the following numbers obtained from Bessler's original drawing:
2 = correct number (not 3!) of curved levers with pivots in the SINGLE deficient left quadrant
3 = number of curved levers with pivots in EACH of the OTHER three NOT deficient quadrants
4 = number of radial members
5 = number represented by the Roman numeral "V" shape made by adjacent radial members
10 = ordinal number of MT10 drawing
15 = correct number (not 16!) of curved levers
The "X" shape of the radial members which can be interpreted as either a "+" sign or a "x" sign allows us to perform some simple arithmetic operations with only these numbers and, if necessary, move a decimal point around which is represented the dot that is an axle pivot.
Can any useful information be obtained about the lever shapes of Bessler's wheels doing that? The surprising answer is YES!
The simplest and most obvious thing we can immediately do numerologically is to just add the 10 and 15 together to get 25. Those who've followed my past comments here will know what I'm going to say next. The 25th letter of the alphabet is the letter "Y" and this clue hidden in MT10 was Bessler's way of telling us that he used "Y" shaped levers in his wheels. However, there are many different ways to draw the letter "Y" depending upon the how one selects at least two of the three angles formed by its three arms. But, how do we know how to accurately pick those two angles?
We can start by trying to find the topmost and smallest angle which I'll call the "fork angle". If we just add together the sum of the four Roman numeral "V" letters formed by the four radial members which is 4 x 5 = 20 with the ordinal number of the drawing which is 10 with the correct number of curved levers which is 15 (not 16!), then we get (5 + 5 + 5 + 5) + 10 + 15 = 20 + 10 + 15 = 45. That would represent a fork angle of 45 degrees. But what about the two side angles of the "Y" shaped levers Bessler used? They could both have very different values or they both could have the same value.
Sayer of Sooths
(continued and concluded in Part 2 of 2)
Part 2 of 2:
DeleteI mentioned a while ago that I had obtained KB's huge Bessler book and was reading my way through it. I did eventually finish it even though it took about two months! I was drawn to his research because, like me, he insists that Bessler used "Y" shaped levers in his wheels and as far as I know we are the only two Bessler wheel researchers who ever claimed that. I had independently determined that lever shape from my own research into the MT clues while he based his conclusion almost exclusively on the various clues he found in the DT portraits of Bessler (btw, other than a very interesting analysis of the many clues in the Toys Page that he provides, KB makes no other mention of the clues in the other MT drawings in his book so he obviously did not spend much time studying them).
Because of those DT portrait clues he found, KB insists that each of the levers in Bessler's wheels had a fork angle of exactly 45 degrees and that its two side angles were equal and both 157.5 degrees. If you add up those three angles you will get 45 + 157.5 + 157.5 = 45 + 315 = 360 degrees and that must be the sum of the angles of a "Y" shaped lever no matter what its three individual angles are.
We already saw above how to quickly get the 45 degree fork angle from the numbers that come out of MT10, but how do we get the 157.5 degree side angle required by the KB wheel lever assuming that it is actually the correct "Y" shape Bessler used? Initially, it looks impossible, but I eventually found a simple way to do it. Here's how.
First take the correct number of curved levers in MT10 which is 15 (not 16!) and multiply it by the drawing's ordinal number or 10 to get 15 x 10 = 150 which represents 150 degrees. But this angle sum is still 7.5 degrees less than the 157.5 degrees KB insists you need. To get that angle just take the correct number of curved levers or 15 and divide them by the number of curved levers whose pivots are in that single deficient left quadrant which is 2 (and not 3!) and you get 15/2 = 7.5. Adding that to the previous angle value gives us 150 + 7.5 = 157.5 degrees.
I think I may do one more installment in which I will give some of the additional information that the MT10 numbers numerologically provide about Bessler's 'Y" shape levers that should appeal to the more advanced students of Bessler's MT clues. Then before I leave this blog again for a while, I have a nice gift for everyone that they may find entertaining as well as personally informative.
Sayer of Sooths
(Conclusion of Part 2 of 2)
Ah Sayre of Sooths you've got a lot of crystal balls answer a simple question the one force utilized in order to give power and acceleration to the machine?!
DeleteWe all know it's gravity, SG, and you don't need a crystal ball to know that. The trick is to make gravity work harder on the descending side weights than it does on the ascending side weights. God told B how to do that, but we sinners will need a crystal ball to find out how it's done.
DeleteAnonymous 21:45 while it's true that gravity plays an important part in all motion that is not the answer I was looking for. if anyone else had discovered that force and correctly deduced it they would be able to give the correct answer. Your perceptions like the majority who do not perceive correctly is a narrow one and without insight. I simply asked the question to deduce whether or not Sayer of Sooths actually understood why the design mt 10 was significant. Seriously folks Bessler gave examples in designs that do not work to draw attention two properties of those designs that were significant to what does. Your generalized statement of we all know is obviously incorrect you're an individual who merely perceives everyone believes as you do and in that case you wrong in your assumption that you speak for everyone else and wrong and your assumption of why I stated the question to Sayer of Sooths . Move Along! Move Along! these are not the droids you are looking for! I'd say May the force be with you but clearly you are from the Dark Side!
DeleteLets get this thing done......
ReplyDeleteAre you ready Gravittea to learn the secret geometry and by the way did you go to the Machine Tool show?
ReplyDeletePart 1 of 2:
ReplyDeleteI had decided not to provide a final installment here, but changed my mind at the last minute because I thought it might be of interest to any beginning numerologists who could then go on to apply its methods to other drawings in Bessler's books.
Below is a link to an MS Paint drawing I made that provides an extended numerological analysis of one of the "Y" shaped levers in Bessler's 3 foot wheel. I am using the lever proposed by KB for that wheel since it is more detailed than what I've been able to find from my own work with MT. I captured an image of that wooden lever that he shows in one of his youtube videos.
That lever, after being rotated 90 degrees counterclockwise to make it look more like the letter "Y", is on the left side of my drawing with its arms labeled as he labels them. I am not really an artist type so I only show the two levers I made to the right of his drawing as three white lines that each extend from the lever's pivot to one of its arm's outermost pins.
He labels the three arms of the "Y" shaped levers used in Bessler's 3 foot diameter wheel as the "main arm" whose outermost pin attaches a small lead weight to it at a distance of 3.5 inches from its pivot, the "A arm" which has its outermost pin at a distance of 1.866 inches from the pivot, and the "B arm" which has its outermost pin at a distance of 2.1 inches from the pin. There are four other pins he has on his levers that I didn't use in my drawing so I could keep it as simple as possible. KB claims that Bessler used this same "Y" shape lever in all of his wheels and just proportionately scaled it up as he made larger diameter wheels. That means that in the four time larger 12 foot diameter wheels that he made, all of the pivot to outermost pin distances I show for the levers used in his 3 foot diameter wheel would have to be quadrupled. That then gives 14 inches as the distance from the pivot to the pin holding a weight at the end of the main arm.
In the middle of my drawing I show my white line version of KB's "Y" shape lever and the various angles between its arms. What I previously called the "fork angle" is formed between the main and A arms. In the white boxes you will find how the angles of 45 and 157.5 degrees were obtained using the MT10 numbers as was described in my previous installment above. On the right side of my drawing you will find some new analysis not described in my previously installments. The white boxes there show how to obtain the various pivot to outermost pin distances in KB's "Y" shaped lever used in the 3 foot diameter wheel by using the MT10 numbers.
https://postimg.cc/McrZBtWn
Sayer of Sooths
(continued and concluded in Part 2)
Part 2 of 2:
DeleteBefore I leave, I must fulfill my promise to give everyone here their GIFT!
As many know, I am a serious student of different forms of divination (or trying to predict future events with some accuracy) and using tarot cards is my favorite form. These cards date back to ancient times and their traditional images are a rich source of esoteric and mystical symbolism. I'm sure that Bessler was well acquainted with them and even used them although Christianity tends to forbid the practice. There was probably a time in the Middle Ages when just getting caught with a deck of these cards could get one burned at the stake!
The problem with using all of the 78 cards in the standard tarot card deck in the various types of card spreads is that it can all be a bit overwhelming for a person just seeking a quick, yet accurate, prediction about some future event that concerns him. Also, finding professionals to do one's tarot card reading can be expensive at $100 to $150 per reading!
I recently came across the following website that will let one get a free computer provided tarot card reading that only uses six cards! I tried it and was amazed by its accuracy. I had an upcoming legal matter and all of my friends were telling me there was no way I could possibly prevail (one of them was actually a lawyer). The cards said differently, however, and to everyone's utter amazement, I won my case and many of them are now also using this site!
https://www.free-tarot-reading.net/free
Simply follow the directions on the website.
One bit of advice though. Don't just keep doing one reading after another until you get one you like for a particular question you ask. Tarot works by telling you what destiny CURRENT external trends around you are pushing you toward IF those trends do not change and thereby also change your destiny.
Think of your tarot card reading like a barometer reading that may slowly change over time. After having a tarot card reading, wait a few days and then do another reading asking the same question. If the external trends have changed during that time, this will be reflected in your new reading.
As you get closer to some anticipated event, continue to take your readings every few days. The external trends may not have changed that much from reading to reading and you should then expect the outcome predicted by your readings likely to happen. However, sometimes external trends can, like the weather, radically change at the last minute.
Enjoy the gift everyone!
Btw. I have a small collection of about a dozen tarot card decks, but none of them has the rich, surrealistic images on their major arcana cards that are used on that website's computer generated cards. I'm now looking for a source that has that exact deck or something very similar to it for sale. So far, no luck.
A friend told me that I might be wasting my time because the images on that website's digital cards were probably custom made just for that website and aren't available on actual cards. I refuse to believe that and my search will continue.
Sayer of Sooths
(Conclusion of Part 2 of 2)
What a funny guy you are Ken comic relief is here again you must be truly bored book Sales down Ken now you're in the now you're into tarot cards hahaha! Ran out of minions didn't you?
DeleteHey Ken have you thought of going door to door! Now that your product line has increased?
Delete@SoS
DeleteYou should have scrolled all the way down to the bottom of that website's homepage that you gave us as a "gift" because they tell you there how to order the tarot cards they use for the site's readings.
It's called "The Lotus Tarot Signature Deck" and it took 3 years for an artist named "Angie" to make. It's limited to only 1,000 decks and each costs $99.00 which is kind of pricey compared to most of the decks selling online.
https://www.free-tarot-reading.net/lotus-tarot-deck
If you think it's too expensive, you can try going over to Etsy.com. They have thousands of less expensive tarot decks for sale and you might find one there that you like as much or even better.
@anon 5:09
DeleteThank you so much for bringing that to my attention! You have saved me a lot of time and trouble hunting around for them online. I don't know how I missed that link at the bottom of their homepage.
I would gladly pay twice as much as they are asking for them especially since they are a limited edition. They are truly a work of art, imo. I will shortly be placing an order for them. Thanks again!
Sayer of Sooths
Thanks for that gift you gave us, SoS! I tried it and now I think I'm hooked. I agree that the card images are great. They have a dream-like quality to them. I can see why you want to own a deck of them.
Delete@SoS
DeleteYou mentioned that Bessler was aware of the tarot cards and probably used them. I agree. Then he would have been aware of the "Wheel of Fortune" card which is in the deck's major arcanna. Here's the image of that card from you gift website:
https://www.free-tarot-reading.net/ltd/images/cards/wheel-of-fortune.jpg
It shows an ever turning wheel that represents the constant state of change in both the universe and the individual. It is the card of destiny and luck. All of the symbols on it have some esoteric meaning. The name of God or "Yahweh" is written on the wheel in Hebrew along with the word "TARO" and we know Bessler attributed his discovery of a working pm wheel design to God.
That particular tarot card is number 10 and you have been talking about MT10 in this blog!
Is it possible that Bessler purposely put those lever clues you showed us into MT10 because he knew those familiar with the tarot deck would relate MT10's number to the Wheel of Fortune tarot card that is also number 10 and shows an ever turning wheel? His message to them (and us) would be that they needed to find those clues he hid in MT10 in order to be able to build one of his pm wheels. Obviously, knowing the correct shape of the levers he used would be a very important clue to find for anyone trying to duplicate Bessler's wheels.
PM Dreamer
@PMD
DeleteYour comment got me to thinking about other possible connections between the drawings in MT and the tarot cards. Your suggestion of the relationship between MT 10 and the 10th tarot card which is the pm wheel of fortune card makes a lot of sense to me. SoS also makes much of MT 13 so I decided to see what the 13th tarot card looks like. Here's an image of it:
https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0023/5061/2525/products/fce4dc75a42ded1043204478e298dcf8_720x.jpg?v=1580867188
This is probably close to the drawing on the 13th tarot card Bessler would have seen and used. It's the famous death card! What could its possible connection to MT 13 be?
Notice that the skeleton, a symbol of death, is swinging that big curved blade around which on some of the cards is shown cutting people's heads off and killing large numbers of them. It was probably inspired by the disease plagues that killed millions throughout history especially the black death of 14th century Europe.
What do we see in MT 13? We also see a large curved counter weight that looks like a blade that would probably swing around a little and because of that makes that wheel unworkable! The blade in tarot card 13 is near the bottom of the drawing and the blade like counter weight in MT 13 is also near the bottom of the wheel. Assuming Bessler intended to link MT 13 to the 13 tarot card then why would he do that?
I checked out what the meanings of the tarot's 13th death card are and was surprised to learn it's only very rarely associated with anyone's actual death. It's thought to represent the end of some period in a person's or nation's history so that a new period that is totally different can begin. In other words it means some big change is coming. But it could be either a big good change or a big bad change! One has to interpret other cards during a reading to determine what kind of change is predicted and if it's bad what to do to change it if it can be changed.
Maybe Bessler, by making MT 13 the 13th drawing in MT and connecting that design to tarot card 13, was telling those familiar with tarot cards that the wheel design shown in MT 13 would result in big changes taking place in the world IF they could make it work? Bessler thought his inventing a working pm wheel with God's help was one of the greatest inventions in history and that's hard to deny and could make big changes on our planet and they would all be good changes. Unfortunately as he soon found out after finding his runner, the changes for him were mostly bad ones.
Also look at Bessler's left hand in the first DT portrait. It looks like its finger is pointing down to the skull in the portrait and the 13th tarot death card is the only one in the entire tarot deck showing a skull! Maybe that was another clue from Bessler that we should concentrate on the design in MT 13 when he eventually published his collection of MT drawings? Why concentrate on that particular MT wheel design? Because he found some way of making it work! Here's the first DT portrait for any newcomers here who haven't seen it yet:
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/bd/Portrait_Bessler.jpg?20170821211025
Simple logic question to you guys , are there 141 cards ?
Delete@JB
DeleteNo. A standard tarot deck only contains 78 cards. 22 are in the major arcana which are the ones used on that "gift" website SoS gave us and 56 are in the minor arcana. So if there's connections between the 22 cards and MT they would only apply to the first 22 MT drawings. But, that doesn't necessarily mean every one of the first 22 MT drawings can be connected to a major arcana card. So far it looks like only two MT drawings might be. There might be others though.
Btw. Most people don't know that our modern 52 card deck of playing cards is actually derived from the tarot's 56 minor arcana cards after the knight cards were removed from its four suits and the knave or page card in each suit was turned into a jack card. The four suits in the tarot's minor arcana of cups, pentacles, swords, and wands eventually became the suits of hearts, diamonds, spades, and clubs in modern playing cards.
I can see why SoS is so fascinated with that deck of tarot cards he is buying. The many symbols in its images immediately give a reader of the cards a lot of impressions of the possible meanings of any card. You could probably actually skip a lot of study of books on the tarot with that deck and just go with the impressions the cards are giving you as they are turned over. I agree with him that it's a visually unique deck.
I just did a quick calculation that shows that by picking only 6 tarot cards from 22 on that gift website of SoS, there are 74,613 different possible fortunes that can be told.
Deletejason
Now imagine the amount of people on earth , how many will have the same fortune ? thats funny to me.
Delete@PM Dreamer and Anon 15:37
DeleteVery impressive! Yes, I think you are both right and there are connections between the MT10 and MT13 drawings and their corresponding numbered cards in the tarot's major arcana. I'm a longtime student of tarot cards and their uses, but I never saw those connections before because I've been focused almost exclusively on the numerological clues in MT. This just goes to show how we can learn something new every day when it comes to Bessler's wheels.
I think you two have pushed MT clue research toward a new and most interesting direction. Well done!
Sayer of Sooths
@anon21:09
DeleteThere is something called the "Celtic Cross" spread that uses 10 cards selected from all 78 cards in a standard tarot deck and it can produce 1,258,315,963,905 different possible predictions! That's over a trillion predictions and enough to give EACH of the 8 billion people on Earth now about 157 different predictions with no two people having any of their predictions the same.
But, the more detailed predictions of the Celtic Cross can take up to an hour to obtain and obviously SoS's "gift" website's method is intended for speedier results at the sacrifice of some detail. I've tried the gift website's method and it's a lot of fun and a great intro to the tarot for beginners.
I shuffle the deck exactly three extra times before I pick the six cards. I then repeat my question about the future before I pick each of the six cards. I don't rush it. I just relax and pick out whatever cards seem to stand out to me because they somehow look a little darker than the other cards.
Gravittea is it possible that you are going to be in the Chicagoland area anytime soon? I would really appreciate the opportunity to discuss a unique plan of action if you are serious about getting it done. I have a unique proposal to disseminate this knowledge I do believe Johan Bessler would definitely approve! Enough of this circular discussions that go nowhere and produce nothing. I have the designs that works not only based on besslers designs and understanding but can also be calculated and proved mathematically sound with known understandings of mechanical engineering it is more than just a possibility it is unequivocally workable and historically accurate.
ReplyDeleteBut, SG, your designs are only "unequivocally workable" over in the bizarro parallel universe that uses a different physics from the one in our universe. Gravittea will want designs that will actually work in our universe using its physics. Can you provide him with any of them?
DeleteShemp
Shemp yes I could give him all the data needed to succeed in a relatively short period of time and he would have the ability to produce large amounts of energy with relatively low maintenance. Maybe even you could benefit from a little education I believe anything is possible although in your case it might be extremely improbable for the time being you should stick to this universe shemp apparently you haven't completed your education in this one.
DeleteWhen are we seeing you and this solution in the news?
Delete@JB
DeleteAll of SG's many discoveries have probably already been all over the news in that "bizarro parallel universe" that Shemp mentioned and he's now a big hero over there. Unfortunately, that news isn't carried by any of the cable news channels in our universe. Thank goodness we have SG here to tell us about them. We could certainly use all of that energy they will produce so we can finally get away from using our polluting fossil fuels for energy.
No... did not go this year, but have always come away with so many great ideas
ReplyDeletePretty cool Suppose to do a Thermal Drone scan of the farm this fall
Gravittea what are you hoping to discover with the thermal drone are you using it to map resources or hunt down Critters?
DeleteGravittea what do you think of developing a toy that teaches the principles of how the machine works? Of course the marketing of this would be to educate the world on the principles involved and the motivation is not for monetary gain it is for the greater good cost based purely on the expense to produce and distribute.
ReplyDeleteWow this went way off the rails. Remember that secret in MT? Yeah probably not.
ReplyDeleteJeff
Comments tend to get silly as a blog approaches and then passes 100 comments and everyone knows JC is getting ready to soon come out with a new blog topic. That accounts for all of that mermaid craziness in the last blog...which was kind of interesting.
DeleteAnd the beat goes on...
ReplyDeletehttps://relativity.tripod.com/webonmediacontents/animatedportrait.gif?1344277865890