Thursday, 21 October 2021

The Strange Attraction of the Perpetual Motion Machine

At first sight it seems remarkable that Bessler  became so committed to searching for the answer to a perpetual motion machine (PM) that he spent ten years or more trying.  This despite the established opinion, even back then, that such devices went against the laws of physics.  But actually he was not alone in this endeavour, as proven by the work of Henry Dircks who described the history of the search in his huge two volume masterpiece. He listed literally hundreds of attempts and failures both honest and not so honest, going back into the dim and distant past. Henry Dircks, Perpetuum Mobile: Or A History Of The Search For Self-Motive Power From The 13th To The 19th Century

Nothing has changed today, we still search for the magic arrangement, despite the weighty opinion against us.  Why do we continue?  Well, two reasons, firstly we and all of our predecessors know that a PM machine is possible, as long as we accept that it is gravity enabled.  How can we know without any evidence?  I can’t explain it, but it is an intuitive and instinctive piece of knowledge, something which formed an intrinsic, perhaps primitive response to a problem who’s solution appeared simple.

The second reason is founded on slightly firmer ground; we have the evidence of Bessler’s wheel, circumstantial it’s true, but it’s very strong, and the only counter argument is the traditional one which claims that it’s impossible.

Over many years I have discovered and discarded numerous ideas, designs and configurations, none worked, but lately I have come to understand just how clever Bessler was, and how ingenious his clues are despite the sheer simplicity of his concept.  He explained exactly how his machine worked and we failed to grasp the true meaning of his words. Everything he wrote had more than one meaning and was so ambiguously phrased that we are confused as to exactly what he meant. I believe I have made the intuitive leap that he made more than 300 years ago, this came about while I was going through his textual clues for the umpteenth time - and I got it….finally!

When I complete our house move I shall test my idea and see if, this time, I got it right. Of course, as I always say, I’ve been here before, many times, but this time I’ve arrived by a different route. I was going through the same old clues and hints trying to read each one in alternative way, trying different words to convey the same information.  He did after all write in a different language to English and in a time 300 years in the past, so sometimes the meanings of words can alter subtly. I don’t mean that our understanding of the words he used is wrong, but the exercise promotes a subconscious re-evaluation of the meaning - I guess! 

JC

88 comments:

  1. I have three things to say here, sir...

    Back then, the misunderstanding that was there about such ideas were against physics laws...

    Yes, that misunderstanding still exists to this day and it is the biggest misguiding factor...

    Secondly, your latest intuitive idea...

    If that has not instantly made you realise, without any room for doubt, that it is it then most probably it isn't...
    Because, when you strike gold you will know it for sure...

    Thirdly, the clues Bessler left...
    Bessler has been very generous... the clues are as simple as the secret design itself...
    The problem is many of us don't realise that these clues become clear only when one is on the right track... or has achieved it...

    Today, I got an email reply from James Dyson's office and, am pasting the same here for your info...

    Good day Suresh,



    Thank you for contacting Dyson and for your willingness to share your idea with us,



    Although we would like to look into the invention/ Idea you have in mind, our engineers are busy researching and developing Dyson’s own inventions. Unfortunately, we are unable to look properly at your idea or any invention from a third party.



    If we were to look at other people’s inventions, it may lead to misunderstandings; so, we must be extremely cautious, especially in terms of Intellectual Property. We are not able, therefore, to accept any confidential information.



    Sir James Dyson knows all too well how important it is to safeguard ideas and inventions. His most important piece of advice to you would be to file a patent application to protect your invention.



    We wish you the best of luck with your idea.



    Kind regards,

    ––
    Reinille
    Owner Support
    Dyson UK

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Nice of them to respond so kindly and politely, but I think they are more interested in proven inventions not plans or drawings.

      JC

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    2. John wrote in this blog "When I complete our house move I shall test my idea and see IF, THIS TIME, I GOT IT RIGHT."

      But Suresh advised you that "Secondly, your latest intuitive idea...If that has not INSTANTLY made you realize, WITHOUT ANY ROOM FOR DOUBT, THAT IT IS IT then most probably IT ISN'T..."

      John, you expressed a hint of doubt so you might as well just forget all about even building your latest idea, whatever it is, since Suresh has already told you that your doubt assures that it probably won't work!

      You are so lucky to have Suresh advising you so you don't any waste time building anything that you are not instantly 100% sure is Bessler's wheel and will work. Maybe you should send him any drawings of your new ideas so he can check them out first and then tell you if they have any chance of working. After all, he already knows the secret of Bessler's wheels so who better to have screen all of your new ideas? Maybe he would even be willing to provide such a valuable service for the rest of the Bessler pm wheel chasers here?

      Delete
    3. Thanks anon 07.18. Sound advice! Lol 😂
      JC

      Delete
  2. This is the standard response I keep getting from whomsoever I get in touch... The world is very sceptical when it comes to PM... Especially so Bessler...

    One quick search of google convinces them about Bessler being a fraud...

    One agency, whom I contacted was very polite till they looked upon Bessler in Google... They got back to me on whatsapp stating they have their concerns regarding Bessler... About his maid's allegations...

    Leave alone others take for instance our own blog... Who cares... Everyone insists on a working model...

    And, when you produce a working model, the problem gets more worse... People like Ken would insist on having a look inside...

    IMHO, all the people in this world are the same... People like rolling are rare... I assure him he won't be disappointed...

    I have been giving so many hints for more than say 10 years on this blog yet 99 percent are sceptical...

    Like Bessler said, it takes a discreet eye to spot a movement... I think people lack that discretion...

    ReplyDelete
  3. Another similar response...

    Hello Mr. Suresh

    You seem to be a very passionate man but during our own brief research on the topic we encountered following discrepencies

    1- Perpetual Motion Machines are impossible to make because they violates 1st and 2nd law of thermodynamics.

    2 - Bessler's Machine was deemed fraud by some after a confession by his maid of operating the machine from behind with rope.

    3 - Many Scientist gave theory on self revolving wheel including Bhaskar from India but they are all just theories none works in real life.

    4 - No Patient office in the world accepts inventions on perpetual motion machines.

    5 - Many People in the world claims they created perpetual motion machines but turns out to be hoaxes.

    6 - Friction from the axel will eventually stop the wheel after some time.

    Therefore we have some concerns over your wheel.

    Thanks and regards

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    1. LOL, Suresh. What were you expecting?
      You cant eat your cake and have it. Nobody is going to build your machine for you. Would you even want that? To give up the chance of seeing your machine run for the first time. If you give up that opportunity, if you sacrifice that on the alter of incapacity, you would forever regret that. It's a feeling all the money in the world cant buy.
      If you had faith in your machine you wouldn't have anyone build it for you. You could have the parts built and then assemble it yourself.
      Step up.
      Cometh the hour, cometh the man.
      Trust me, we are all trying to be that man. It is a race. You are in a race and you dont even know it, we are all in this race. It's a race for the greater good but albeit a race. A competition.
      Dont be the hare
      Goodluck

      Delete
  4. Thanks a lot, buddy... Definitely, I will...

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  5. Anyone who hasn't read Dircks' book on the history of perpetual motion machines yet can do so here for free:

    https://archive.org/details/perpetuummobile00dircgoog/page/n2/mode/2up

    I got interested in pm wheels because it seems to make sense that a wheel should keep turning if there is some way for it to mechanically shift its weights around so that their center of mass always stays on one side of the wheel. It sounds like it should not be too hard to do. Then, after I tried to do that over the years with several dozen wheels I built, I realized how extremely difficult it really is to do and most would say impossible to do. But, Bessler obviously found a way to do it. He wrote in DT:

    "NO, these weights are themselves the PM device, the ‘essential constituent parts’ which must of necessity continue to exercise their motive force (derived from the PM principle) indefinitely so long as they keep away from the center of gravity. To this end they are enclosed in a structure or framework, and coordinated in such a way that not only are they prevented from attaining their desired equilibrium or ‘point of rest’, but they must forever seek it, thereby developing an impressive velocity which is proportional to their mass and to the dimensions of their housing. This velocity is sufficient for the moving and raising of loads applied to the axis of rotation."

    He's describing an overbalanced wheel, but unlike all of the ones I tried to build it's one that is always overbalanced. As one of his wheels began to turn, its weights which we assume are on the ends of levers must have automatically and constantly shifted themselves so as to both raise their center of mass and also move it away from the center of the axle and that double action then kept it located on the wheel's descending side. I don't think the levers moved independently of each other as I see many doing in their wheel designs. They are connected together or "coordinated" in some special way. Find a way to coordinate them and you will find a way to constantly keep their center of mass on a wheel's descending side.

    jason

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    1. Thanks for that link to Dircks' book on the subject, Jason. I located the part that deals with Bessler and his wheels and it begins on the book's page 94. Anyone interested in reading that material will find it here:

      https://archive.org/details/perpetuummobile00dircgoog/page/n128/mode/2up

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  6. The inventor must be the most skeptical of all.

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  7. While everyone here is endlessly debating how Bessler's wheels worked, this guy already has his pm wheel up and running. It uses five permanent magnets and his design has been duplicated successfully by others! I'm very tempted to see if I can make a copy. If I could I would keep in right in my living room to use as a conversation pieces when guests come over.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bNPNEgb1EEI

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    1. Here's another video I found of the same pm wheel which gives a better view of its mechanism in action. It took the inventor many tries before he got it to finally work.

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r4N4TiOHc-g

      Delete
    2. Nice toy, but it looked fishy from the very beginning! This is how he did it: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=npbZspqswes

      By the way, there are, I think 4 videos made by this guy, on some Ken B. made his comments, even he got fulled. So much for being "expert" on PM

      Cheers BNR.

      Delete
    3. It's hard to know what to make of this magnetic motor. His explanation about flipping the weak drive magnet in the dead zones of those ring shaped magnets on the wheel sounds plausible. But, I've seen so many fakes on youtube that my gut wants to tell me this must be another one of them.

      I looked at that video BNR linked to that tries to debunk his magnetic motor and which shows how it could be done using a magnetic reed switch, coil, and battery hidden in part of the base. Yes, I suppose that is possible and that objection could have been eliminated by him using clear plastic instead of wood for the base.

      But, if we assume he did that, then we have to conclude that the others claiming to have duplicated his design are all hoaxing as well! To be fair to Ken B, he did initially say that the wheel only "appeared" to be genuine. He only sounds like he accepts it as genuine after the builder provided a link to another person's video who made a working copy of it.

      https://youtu.be/rR-sdvX2_CE

      Again, that other person uses a thick wooden base and the skeptics can immediately say there must be that magnetic reed switch, coil, and battery hidden in the base to power the ring magnets on the wheel's rim as they reach the wheel's 6:00 position. But, at time 2:20 in that video, the guy removes the assembly with the weak flipping drive magnet in it and over the next minute or so the wheel slows until it almost stops! If the wheel was being powered by a hidden coil triggered by a magnetic reed switch in the thick wooden base, then it should have kept right on running. I can see why Ken B would have been convinced that this invention is genuine. That detail is hard to dismiss.

      It would be nice, however, on any future models made by others if they would use as many clear plastic parts as possible. I wonder, assuming this is genuine, if the wheel's speed and power could be increased by placing those little flipping magnets at its 9:00 and 3:00 positions? Using return springs on the flipping magnets, one might be able to place them all around the wheel's rim! I don't think we've seen the last of this one.

      Delete
    4. Hi Ken, thanks for your response, to be honest, I was expecting it.
      This wheel looks fishy right of the start, and a person like you should have spot it right away, but you did not, you just fell in the trap.
      This is the link this inventor gave you

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rR-sdvX2_CE&t=216s

      to prove that there is nothing hidden. Now at 2:27s he removes this contraption with small magnet (apparently the driving force of the wheel) and the wheel keeps rotating with out it till 3:36s, at this point he holds this contraption on the other side of the wheel and manually lifts the small magnet (weakened by heating !!!???) At 3:51s he walks away and the wheel keeps rotating with no loss in speed to 3:59, at this point he mounts that contraption with small magnet back in its original place. Amazing!!!

      Above Ken wrote: “To be fair to Ken B, he did initially say that the wheel only "appeared" to be genuine”, no offense but that’s a lie, this is what you wrote on you tube: “Anyway, good luck with this, it's nice to see genuine devices starting to appear on youtube.”

      Best regards
      BNR

      Delete
    5. @BNR

      I think you missed the point that anon 21:19 was trying to make which is that between time 2:25 when Antonio Ijano removes that little activator magnet and time 3:35 when he moves it over to the wheel's 9:00 position, there is a noticeable decrease in the speed of the wheel. That should not have happened if the wheel was being driven by a reed switch triggered electromagnet hidden in its wood base which would have kept the speed constant.

      I timed how long his wheel took to complete 10 turns before he removed the activator magnet and it needed about 18 seconds. Just before he moved the activator magnet over to the 9:00 position, the wheel needed 33 seconds to complete the 10 turns. Its speed had decreased by almost 50% during the 70 seconds when it was not being driven by the activator magnet and was coasting to a stop which would have mainly been due to air drag on the ring magnets and wheel spokes.

      Stan

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    6. Since my OOB wheel research is going nowhere I'm thinking of trying to build one of these so I'll at least have something that works. I'm wondering if it would work without using those ring magnets on the wheel's rim. Could it work with just flat square ferrite magnets that are face polarized if you put two next to each other on the rim with a space between them? Not sure what to use for the little weakened magnet that flips. If I make it I will mount it on a wood base but put a big cut out hole under where the bottom of the wheel rim is. I don't want to work with plastic if I can avoid it.

      Delete
    7. While I'm impressed with the Ken B version of Bessler's wheels, there is no way I will ever be trying to build one because I don't have the skills required to do something like that. I do however think I could build one of these ring magnet wheels.

      Anon 04:40, I think that wheel would actually work better by not using ring magnets. If I decide to build one I will also use ferrite magnets but ones that are rectangular and one inch wide, three inches long, and a quarter inch thick. I'll just hot glue them in pairs around a wooden wheel's rim and put a space of about two inches between each in a pair. I'll also use a rectangular ferrite magnet for the little rotating magnet. That would be three inches long by a quarter inch square. Making the wheel will be the easy part. From those videos it looks like you have to do a lot of adjusting before you can get one to run continuously.

      I'd like to have it mounted on a piece of transparent plastic so I don't get accused of hoaxing it, but like you I don't like working with plastic materials. I'm going to start making some drawings and also see if I can find an online supplier for the ferrite magnets. I like the idea that it is so small and can easily be put on a table or shelf and just left running. Of course, I won't let it run constantly because I don't want its mechanical metal parts to wear out. I'll just start it up when showing it off to friends. I'm curious to see what their reactions will be.

      I think if we see more and more people building these that work, it won't be long before some Chinese company starts mass producing and exporting them all over the planet. That might actually make the science world more accepting of pm machines in general and also Bessler's wheels in particular.

      Delete
    8. Here's a quick route that will allow JC to solve the Bessler wheel in no time!

      All he has to do is simply come up with a flipping magnet design that he can put into the drum of a Bessler wheel. Just have eight pairs of lodestone magnets attached to the inside surface of the drum's outer rim so the design can make those eight noises per wheel rotation that were reported. To make the sounds just put a flipping magnet gadget at the end of a long arm inside of the drum that extends out from the axle to the 3 o'clock position of the drum to pull / push the magnets there along and make the carefully balanced drum slowly accelerate when released and the rim magnets are near the flipping magnet or after the drum is given a little push if the rim magnets are not yet close enough to the flipping magnet.

      That arm would be attached to the top part of a heavy pendulum like the one in MT13 that hung down off of the hidden part of the axle inside of the drum and that would keep the horizontally extended arm with the flipping magnet mechanism on it virtually motionless as it pull / pushed the magnets along on the inner rim wall of the drum.

      You think that Bessler didn't have magnets to use? Wrong! He could have used cut pieces of lodestone for his magnets and their magnetic fields would not have to be that strong. But what about those lead weights pulled out of the Merseburg wheel during its official test? What about them? They were only used together to make the bottom part of that big pendulum hanging down off of the axle. They did play a role in helping to drive the drum...just not like Bessler led everyone to think they did. He was so deceptive about that and led everyone to think he had some kind of clever overbalanced wheel design. Not true! Count Karl knew that, but could not reveal it and he was the kind of guy who kept his word.

      Next, JC has to go back through the history of Bessler and find something that proves he experimented with lodestones at one time. Maybe he was looking for buried treasure and found a big deposit of them? Maybe some of them were listed in the items from his estate? Maybe that alchemist he saved told him to get them and grind them up to make some sort of weird salve to draw poisons out of a sick person's body? JC just has to find something...anything about him using lodestones!

      Also, JC has to go through all of Bessler's drawings and look for anything that even remotely looks like a piece of stone attracting another piece of stone or iron. Those four little odd shaped bars on the table in the bottom right part of the 2nd portrait in DT look suspiciously like they could be bar magnets made out of cut pieces of lodestone!

      With that done, JC then declares that HE has finally solved the Bessler wheel mystery and that all of these ring magnet motors showing up in youtube videos prove that Bessler actually used magnets! No need for JC to get his hands dirty trying to build anything. Sooner or later someone else will use the drawing JC published showing how lodestones propelled Bessler's wheels and then make a working model from it which keeps everything inside of the drum and works just like Bessler's wheels did. JC then gets the historical credit for solving the mystery!

      Now that we've seen how these ring magnet pm wheels work, solving Bessler's wheels with them should be a simple matter for anyone who makes the effort to do so.

      Delete
    9. @Anon 07:12

      In the list of items from Bessler's estate #21 was "Two fine magnetic stones"! #22 was a "Compass for mine surveying" so he could have been using that to determine the north and south poles of the lodestone magnets he used inside of his wheel drums. What you suggested is starting to make sense at least to me. I think Bessler would have known a lot about "magnetic stones" and how to use them in machines. Why has this obvious possibility been ignored for so long?

      Delete
    10. Before you guys get too excited about Bessler using lodestone magnets to make his wheels run, you might want to consider that the scientists examining his wheels at official tests would have also thought of that possibility. They would have suspected that he could be using some sort of hidden magnets either in the ceiling over a top of a wheel's drum or in the floor under the bottom of a wheel's drum to somehow attracted or repelled magnets hidden inside of the outer rim of the drum to move it along. They would have scanned those places with compasses to see if their needles would react to any strong magnetic fields there. If they had found any we would know about it. I think it's unlikely Bessler used magnets to make his wheels run.

      Delete
  8. Ignorance screams loudest!

    Faking videos is a sport on You Tube. However there are some things a bona fide inventor would do knowing this, and the tirade that would follow unless he took precautions, unless of course he welcomed controversy and number viewing count.

    A clear headed skeptic would also keep all these in mind before endorsing a video as genuine, including claims of replication.

    Raised off the table (large air gap) and made of transparent material, so it can be viewed right through, from all sides. A candle nearby to identify any air disturbances that might be driving it like a fan. A transparent box covering lowered over it while in operation and left there. A wide black tape rim perimeter on the flat surface it is propped up on to show any fishing nylon pull mechanism as per Mylow. Passing a broom under the table top to catch other physical cheat methods like wires. Laser lights might be a bit extreme. A simultaneous wide angle pan shot showing the room and surrounds, and the inventor (he can wear a mask), running alongside the close ups. ETC.

    I'm sure there are other cheat detection methods that we could think of, if required.

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    1. I think no matter what anti-hoax features are in a pm machine video, a hardcore skeptic will immediately say there is something that we're not seeing and so the video has to be a hoax. They devoutly follow the 1st law of thermo and any machine that is outputting energy without a source they understand is impossible...period...end of story...case closed. That video MUST be a hoax.

      Even when a physical working model is actually presented, the skeptics will still denounce it as a fake. There was Turkish inventor named Yildiz years ago that demonstrated a working permanent magnet motor he invented to a group of professors and engineers at the Delft University of Technology in the Netherlands. It was estimated to be outputting hundreds of watts of power! Videos of that demonstration were on the web and still he was accused of hoaxing the demonstration despite him disassembling the motor and letting the witnesses handle the parts. All his motor consisted of was plastic, aluminum, and rare earth magnets. But, because everyone "knows" pm is impossible, the skeptics quickly declared that it had to be a hoax and he a scammer.

      And we all know the sad story of Bessler. Despite several official tests by serious professionals who signed a letter saying he had something real, how is he remembered today in his own country? Just another hoaxer and con man!

      These kinds of reactions are enough to dampen anyone's desire to find a design for a pm machine that actually works. Why bother? Because whatever you do, you can be sure that you will be quickly denounced as being a hoaxer, a liar, and a crook...all by people whose only form of "exercise" is jumping to false conclusions and then getting some sadistic pleasure out of insulting others without having all of the facts. Why give them another opportunity to exercise their personality disorders with you and your invention being their latest convenient target of opportunity?

      Delete
  9. So what happened to Yildiz and his motor? I doubt the entire motor was x-rayed at Delft.

    Did anyone go to his home and see if he was still connected to the grid and paying his electricity bills. Might be worth a look lol.

    And if you do a video of your runner just make sure you make a clear claim that no deceit is involved. Amazing how many people making videos and sims don't do that.

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    1. There hasn't been much talk about Yildiz in the last few years, but I did find this online:

      "In July 2019 the first part of an intended series of livestreamed tests was started. The setup at the company D'Ambros in Belluno in Italy comprised among various equipment a 7,5 kW Yildiz Motor which propels a generator. At first the self-running and zero emission Yildiz Motor operated well for about 7 hours and this can be already considered a success. After about 7 hours a technical defect did arise and the Yildiz Motor had to be stopped. It is intended to continue the test when the Yildiz Motor is repaired."

      Whether this demonstration was hoaxed or not is anyone's guess. If Yildiz actually had working 7.5 kw permanent magnet motors, he could be selling them worldwide now, making a fortune, and we'd all be using them to power our homes and automobiles. Where are they if they are real?

      Delete
    2. Here's a video of that 7 hour test done by the D'Ambros company in Belluna, Italy on the Yildiz 7.5 KW permanent magnet motor that was livestreamed on July 5, 2019.

      It's boring to watch because you can't see what is happening. Supposedly Yildiz' motor ran an alternator with no electrical load on it for about 6 hours and then they ended the test because of some technical problem with the motor although the livestream continued for another hour. But, despite that his motor did run continuously for at least 6 hours and that is impressive by itself...assuming it was not hoaxed with lithium batteries hidden somewhere inside of it. Hopefully, his motor was carefully checked before the test to make sure it did not contain any batteries.

      Apparently, the company planned to use the alternator's current in the next test to heat up 1000 liters of water in a nearby insulated tank and then use the increase in its temperature to determine how much energy Yildiz' motor actually produced. In that test the motor would run continuously for 72 hours or 3 days. I don't know if that second test ever took place. Supposedly, it would not be livestreamed and only open to a few people and independent researchers. If it ever took place I would certainly like to know what the measured total electrical energy production of his motor had been.

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ikP6n0YYG-A

      Delete
    3. @anon 21:55:

      Here's a short video of a preview of that second test that was supposed to be done with the Yildiz magnet motor by that D'Ambros company in Italy. They briefly show his 7.5 kilowatt unit and its much larger than I thought it would be but should still fit into even a small car.

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3yf6GyamSKw

      I haven't been able to find out whether or not that second test was ever done and if it was what its results were.

      Here's another short video I found with some nice see through 3d graphics that claims to show how the Yildiz magnet motor works. In its comments Ken B disagrees with the explanation given in the video!

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sk2s8fHSP9k

      Delete
    4. Ken B was right. That guy who made that 3D video of Yildiz magnet motor insides didn't show the correct rotor it used. He makes it look simpler than it really is. It's not accurate.

      Delete
  10. Hmmm .. I haven't seen to much swearing on their family bibles but would do it in a court of law. It must be the cameras.

    ReplyDelete
  11. Today received a second email message pasted below from Dyson's office as they were advised to directly respond to the individual...

    Good day Suresh,



    Thank you for showing an interest in sharing your idea with us,



    Without protection for your idea, you are vulnerable to someone else making use of it without your permission and/or without giving you the appropriate recognition. You should therefore find out whether your idea can be protected and, if it can be, protect it.



    Our recommendation is that you take advantage of the free clinics offered by the Chartered Institute of Patent Agents (0207 4059450), and the literature they can offer. If you can take advice from a professional Patent Agent (there will probably be some listed in your local Yellow Pages or the Chartered Institute will let you have details of the local agents), we recommend that you do so, although initial advice may well cost you between £100 & £200.



    If you would like to investigate funding for a new venture, get in touch with your local Chamber of Commerce and see if they can recommend some grant providers. We would also caution you to be wary of outfits who offer to market or license your invention for you. In our experience these do not usually work out well for the inventor.



    The Chartered Institute may also be able to let you know how to get hold of a helpful booklet called "A Better Mousetrap", which is recommended as a useful source of information and advice. It also contains a lot of useful addresses and telephone numbers. You will have to pay for the booklet, but it is worth the money.



    We would like to wish the very best with your future endeavors and hope the above is of use to you.



    Kind regards,

    ––
    Reinille
    Owner Support
    Dyson UK

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    1. What a polite way to say "Get Lost!"

      Delete
  12. Which bit are you not getting SK ? .. you can not get a patent for a "PM device" in the USA etc unless you produce a real world "runner". If you are not able to build it outsource the components and assemble yourself (spread the risk by not revealing the complete device to one shop if worried). Or partner up with someone who can build it for you (under whatever arrangement you come to with them). Once you have a runner then apply for patent examination and award of local or international patent (cost could be dependent on country coverage). Then licence the patent or build a manufacturing and development factory yourself and supply the market. Or take it to the likes of Dyson or your local Chamber of Commerce etc. You will need to show it under cover of a legally enforceable nda perhaps.

    Or .. you can release the details of your alleged runner on the internet. And let the chips fall where they may. Many people will critique the idea looking for its strengths and possible weaknesses. They may well even suggest some mechanical improvements in efficiency and power etc. What can't be escaped is that you are the original author of the idea, for all time.

    Since you have been sitting on the fence for 30 years as you say, then you have reached a moral impasse, not a physical barrier. Only you can examine your inner most self and find a way on from your self imposed roadblock, imo.

    However you have said to this blog on more than one occasion that you will start building it, and begin the testing of validity process. Most of us know full well that transitioning an idea in your head or on paper into a real world device that is an actual runner is not easy and can have disappointments and frustrations along the journey. Possibly a viable solution to B's. PM mechanics (or any free-energy device) is a once in a century or less probability. Shoot for the stars and you might hit the moon. IOW's try to keep things in perspective. Your Math may have a weakness or hole in it that you did not fully appreciate at the time but you find out as you build. And that needs a 'workaround' to move forward again. Or if you are a sure as you and SG and KB appear to be it all goes swimmingly well and you knock out a "runner" in no time flat. The point is to walk the talk.

    -f

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    1. All we are seeing in this blog are a few of the replies that SK gets from companies like Dyson. We are not seeing any of the inquiries he sends to them. In those he could just be telling them that he's solved Bessler's wheels and will sell them the secret to use as an energy supply for their products for 100 million US dollars and then asks if they are interested. Then he adds, oh btw I have it all figured out in my head, but I don't have a working model or a patent and I know next to nothing about math or science. So, do we have a deal? Lol!

      I'm surprised they even waste time replying to him. They probably just put his name and email address on a list along with hundreds of others they get every day that a computer program then uses to send him and others the same polite auto reply email filled with various recommendations which he will just ignore and he then keeps on fishing around for some other company with money to invest that might take his bait. No wonder he's been playing this useless game for decades so far.

      Lucky for him that the internet was invented so he can at least save money on postage!

      Delete
    2. Anonymous anonymous anonymous you are correct in the instruction that the u.s. patent office has to have a model that works to award a patent for a p.m. device however you left out the part that anything that generates energy such as a real p.m. device would be screened by the military and the other governmental agencies that overlook whether it would be a threat to National interest and security I guarantee it would be and you would be informed your rights to build and Market such a device no longer exist the issue would be classified and the reason given you would be because it threatens National interest and security. It is only logical to conclude that this has happened many times before the only way to give such a device to the people of the world is to saturate the world with the information all at once with full instructions on how to build it but even then they will try to put that cat back in the bag and to launch a campaign to discredit it as quickly as they can their infrastructure to do this is already in existence hundreds of thousands of machines that don't work in a unbelievable amount of people constantly professing it's impossible if it was really impossible why would they waste their time an effort to constantly beat that drum so now you know what they're saying isn't stupid it's for a reason to lay a foundation too easily discredited

      Delete
    3. That was probably one of the most sensible comments you've ever made here, SG!

      Delete
  13. Fletcher... thanks... Your points do make a lot of sense... You have said it all... The ball is in my court now...

    BW was successfully built about 300 years back...

    But the man who built it couldn't sell it...
    He hit roadblock...

    There are many now who are constantly trying to figure it out since then but still there seems to be some roadblock...

    And now, I am finding it hard to get it together after so many years of efforts on figuring it out...

    Still roadblock...

    Why obstructions all along?...

    Probably, we haven't figured out why it is so?...

    Now, my first task is to find out why the roadblocks exists in the first place?...

    I would like to ask JC sir to come with a blog on the various reasons for roadblocks...

    It is possible that the time is not ripe yet...

    It is also possible that the world is not interested in it...

    And then, it is also possible that there exists a big misunderstanding...

    The very mention of the term PM creates some sort of scepticism...

    Maybe, BW is actually not a PM device...

    The parts needed for assembling the same are not readily available...

    There is a constant fear of the secret getting leaked during the process of outsourcing...

    Perhaps, IMO, the very fragility of the secret is its main hindrance...

    Also, the patenting processes being so expensive, cumbersome and stringent could be another reason...

    Whatever else be the reason or reasons for hindrances the very fact that BW is possible is keeping the matter alive...

    There is still no concensus amongst besslerites on how the wheel operates...

    It very disheartening to see it being merged with magnetism now by Ken...

    I am afraid that BW quest may soon lose its originality and charm...

    The charm that kept us going till now...

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Suresh, it's obvious that you are getting nowhere on your own with your idea. You would be better off revealing what you think is Bessler's big secret and include a sketch or two of it. Let John post it here and let others see and discuss it.

      If you have anything that looks good then most will say so and maybe even try to build it for you or use its principle in their own designs. If it's nonsense then most will also tell you that and some will even insult you as they did John last year after he finally revealed his Bessler - Collins gravity wheel design. But at least you will finally be able to get off of that fence you are balanced on and will know one way or another.

      If you have anything of value you will get the credit for it. If it's nonsense then you can finally forget about it and look for another solution if you still have the enthusiasm to do so. John has put that nonrunning design he revealed last year behind him and is now planning to make a new start.

      Cleaning all of the useless junk out of one's attic, basement, and garage after years of it collecting there and just gathering more dust can feel good. So can making a fresh start with one's Bessler research.

      Delete
    2. The reason Bessler didn't sell it and the reason you aren't showing it is one and the same reason. Bessler even told us why the world doesn't turn round properly.
      GREED
      Your are a selfish greedy bastard. You think you are more important than the other 8 billion people living on this planet and if, as with Bessler, you don't manage to get the exact terms you want, you will sulk in a corner
      My advice would be that you get over yourself, and you do some good for the whole of this planet.
      The truth that PM isn't impossible will hurt a lot of peoples feelings and the truth about you, probably hurts yours. You are an egocentric fool.
      This is, obviously, just my opinion, and anyone who wishes to think, that you or themselves, is more important than the well-being of the entire planet, is free to do so.
      RH46

      Delete
  14. Like I said SK they are your self imposed roadblocks. As they are for SG and KB.

    I would lay money on it that all 3 of you are quite superstitious people. That comes thru in your above justifications for not progressing.

    Many people have superstitions, some few and small, some many and large. Some have none that they are aware of tho culturally it is hard to eliminate them entirely. Usually superstition is not what it seems. The cricketer who always wears the same underwear that he once scored a ton in. The rugby player who always ties his left boot before his right. The poker player that always wears his favourite sun glasses. The financial trader that always games online for before making a big trade.

    The point is it is not the routine itself that is important to them. It is that association that once they scored big and they want to recreate those same conditions. But of course it never quite works out and their batting is still erratic and their trades still average from time to time. So what benefit can being superstitious bring to your table ?

    It puts you in a positive frame of mind. It puts your brains waves in a better state, or relaxation, or focus, to achieve what you want to achieve. And sometimes you do as a result. Sometimes you do not. Perhaps you think on average you preform better after reciting your mantras etc. Probably you do, statistically. So mostly they do no harm, except when they stop you moving forward.

    So Superstitions have a place to prepare you. They themselves have no power over you.

    We are long past the era of the Myans sacrificing 16 year old girls to thank the Gods after a drought has broken so there won't be a future one. Or believing that volcanoes erupt and throw rocks at you because the Gods are displeased with your tribe, like you throw rocks at other tribes. Or that earthquakes are Gaia letting us know that she is not pleased.

    And yet an incredible number of people have superstition roadblocks, even if they don't always recognise them.

    I would suggest for superstitious people that you just say to yourself "everyday in everyway my life gets better and better". And see how that goes for you. No harm no foul.

    -f

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Maybe Climate Change is Gaia's way letting us know she's not pleased with all of those greenhouse gases we put into the atmosphere every year!

      Delete
  15. I agree, maybe the superstition beliefs has have the better of me...

    I am planning to acquire some rods and weights and see if can assemble a wooden structure and get them fixed into it...

    The measurement has to be accurate... A little bit of friction here and a bit more weight there are not going to pose a big problem as long as the arrangement retains its position...

    The arrangement and measurement the are two critical things that matter... getting the parts designed accordingly shouldn't be a hard task... I can approach the local engineering workshop...

    Fortunately, for me, the research part is already done... I don't have to worry about that at all... Just building it and safeguarding the same is going to be the important work...

    A smaller wheel size could be convenient to handle but, in that case, the accuracy level of the measurement goes up... So, I can't afford to scale down the size...

    Already, I am beginning to see the action inside... As the incredible performance happens... Of an interesting endless game being played out... By one weight against another... Recreating those noises recorded by the observers...at that time...

    ReplyDelete
  16. Another great failure...

    Dear Suresh Kumar,

    Thank you for applying and submitting your business idea for the National Bio Entrepreneurship Competition (NBEC) 2021.

    We have received an overwhelming response to the Call for Applications and have completed the review process. We would like to inform you that your application has not been shortlisted for the next round.

    We appreciate your interest in the competition and the efforts you put in submitting the business idea. We hope that you will take advantage of our other programmes related to bio-entrepreneurship that we conduct throughout the year and across the country. We will keep you posted about our forthcoming events and you can also visit our website for more information https://www.nationalbioentrepreneurship.in/

    Best regards,
    BREC Team, C-CAMP

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. "We would LIKE to inform you that your application has NOT been shortlisted for the next round." !!!

      Sounds like they actually enjoyed telling you to get lost! Whatever happened to "We regret to inform you that..." or "We are sorry to inform you that..." or "It saddens us to inform you that..."?

      Delete
  17. Your assumption that we are superstitious is rather funny from someone who calls himself anonymous, you really have to appreciate that kind of Comedy! and your last line no harm no foul purely icing on the cake and pretending to give Sound Advice seriously what do you know about anything about Bessler and how he left his design in his drawings and poetry believe it or not if you really wanted to figure out what Bessler had to say watch (2001 Space Odyssey) and then watch (2010 The year we make contact) see if you can make the connections between Bessler Clues and those movies.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Stephen, your assumption that the anon you refer to is anonymous is really quite funny because we all know who he is because he always signs himself with a small -f, so we know it’s our well-respected and dear friend ‘fletch’.

      JC

      Delete
    2. You're absolutely right, SG...the secret of Bessler's wheels is hidden in that space station from Kubrick's movie, but the pathetic dullards here are just too blind to see it! Good thing you're on this blog to help finally open up their eyes!

      https://d253pvgap36xx8.cloudfront.net/blog/image/4b0749043fbb11e6b21b0242ac110002.jpg

      Delete
    3. John whether the case is with the small F or not his statements an assumption that we are superstitious in the way we approach the issue is ridiculous for people to assume that bessler spoke and wrote In code is also ridiculous he gave Clues in allegory and symbols. By the way John the number 55 is meant to signify allegory something that looks the same but has a difference this may come as a shock to you but that's only one example of many

      Delete
    4. A person who is "superstitious" has a "superstition" which I found defined online as:

      "1a : a belief or practice resulting from ignorance, fear of the unknown, trust in magic or chance, or a false conception of causation. b : an irrational abject attitude of mind toward the supernatural, nature, or God resulting from superstition. 2 : a notion maintained despite evidence to the contrary."

      Sounds like it could describe the majority of Bessler pm wheel chasers!

      Delete
    5. That's what I liked about words that have been redefined you always have your out! How stupid is that for progress. why don't you make up another definition I go by the etymology of words and the route meanings and by the way so did Bessler. So every discussion has plausible deniability it's disgusting! Yeah let's discuss the definition of that word too. Why don't you go up to the El Ron Hubbard redefining words and no psychoanalyzed yourself in a mirror engrams entrails have your pick!

      Delete
  18. Why it is proving to be difficult to almost everyone to make a pound raise four pounds?...

    Traditional methods presently being adapted don't seem to work... Then what really could be the actual solution?... What is it that made Bessler successful?...

    Out of the box thinking is not happening... More time is spent in leg pulling by some rather than concentrate on the solution... Too many deviation occurring... Quality time is not being spent on figuring out how Bessler could achieve it... Everyone has is own theory... Simple clues provided by Bessler are not being investigated instead more complex ones are being considered...

    BW is all about extreme simplicity... simple mechanism used in a smart manner... Yes, BW is a smart wheel... Too smart during Bessler time, not so at present times...

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. >>Why it is proving to be difficult to almost everyone to make a pound raise four pounds?

      Here one way to do it. But how to do in wheel that turns?? That is hard part.

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iB7R2ttYWCw

      Delete
  19. Gute freunde von Bessler hier ist ein geschenk von Bessler zum spielen.

    https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/i/JEEB1717/wheel_kifepom.jpg


    JEEB1717

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Lol! This is a hoax, right? Bessler didn't make any wheel drawings in 1705. But, it does look interesting. Amazing how many kooks show up on this blog. Lol!

      Delete
    2. Actually Bessler probably made a lot of drawings and they are not all in the books we now have. Maybe not all of them were lost? Assuming this image is genuine, it could have been made during the decade he struggled to find a solution. I'd like to know more about where it came from because I've never seen it before. It looks like something that could have come right out of his MT collection. JEEB1717 if you are reading and translating these comments, then please do tell us where you got this from.

      There's no denying that the wheel is overbalanced and it looks like the weights at the ends of the levers are supposed to slide along the levers behind them so as to keep the wheel out of balance. It also looks like it should be bidirectional, but you'd have to force it to rotate counterclockwise a full turn to make it start turning in that direction.

      jason

      Delete
    3. @anon 01:28
      If this is a hoax, it's one of the better ones I've seen. That wheel looks like it would work!

      Delete
    4. Hallo mein Bessler freund Jason! Ich fand eine familie, die ein Bessler zeichnungsbuch hatte und es mir vor ein paar jahren zu einem hohen preis verkaufte. Sie brauchten dringend geld. Ein seemannsvorfahre sollte es ĂŒber bord werfen, um das schiff vor dem untergang zu bewahren, aber er behielt es. Ich habe einmal gerĂŒchte darĂŒber gehört und dann habe ich ĂŒber zwanzig jahre gebraucht, um sie zu finden und das buch zu kaufen. Es ist einzigartig, aber in schlechtem zustand. Nicht viel zu lesen, nur dutzende von zeichnungen von Bessler frĂŒhen rĂ€dern. Er hatte viele ideen, aber ich glaube nicht, dass sie funktionierten. Das buch war signiert und ein experte bestĂ€tigte, dass es sich vor dem kauf um eine echte Bessler signatur handelte. Ich kann nicht zeichnen, also macht mein freund zeichnungen aus dass bĂŒch fĂŒr mich. Ich werde Ihnen in zukunft weitere zeichnungen von Bessler schenken. Ich bin jetzt ein alter mann, aber wenn ich sterbe, sagt mein letztes testament, das bĂŒch in die bibliothek fĂŒr seltene bĂŒcher in der nĂ€he meiner stadt gehen. Sie sind gute leute und werden sich darum kĂŒmmern.

      JEEB1717

      Delete
    5. Here's a google translation of JEEB1717's second comment. He's making an astounding claim if it's true!

      "Hello my Bessler friend Jason! I found a family who had a Bessler drawing book and sold it to me a few years ago at a high price. They desperately needed money. A sailor ancestor was supposed to throw it overboard to save the ship from sinking, but he kept it. I heard rumors about it once, and it took me over twenty years to find them and buy the book. It's unique, but in bad shape. Not much to read, just dozens of drawings of Bessler's early bikes. He had a lot of ideas, but I don't think they worked. The book was signed and an expert confirmed that it was a real Bessler signature prior to purchase. I can't draw, so my friend makes drawings for me. I will give you more drawings from Bessler in the future. I'm an old man now, but when I die, says my last testament, the book will go to the rare book library near my town. They are good people and they will take care of it.

      JEEB1717"

      Bessler's "early bikes"? Sounds like a mistranslation. It's probably supposed to be "early wheels".

      Delete
    6. This doesn't make sense. How can throwing Bessler's book of wheel drawings overboard keep a ship from sinking?

      Delete
    7. Not just books... maybe, to reduce weight most of the unnecessary cargo is usually discarded in emergencies...and the book must have been part of that cargo...

      Anyway, all this seems to be madeup story... But still, we shouldn't ignore anything... You never know, there is a learning from everything...

      Sometimes, I was able to get very critical information from the most unexpected source...

      That's why I read and consider everything that I come across... Truth will eventually become known, anyway...

      Delete
    8. @anons 11:52 and 15:26

      I recall reading that during the 1730's Bessler invented a submarine of some sort that was to be used in an emergency to rescue the crew and cargo of a ship that was sinking in a storm. We have no images of that submarine, but supposedly Bessler came up with the idea because he was once on a ship that hit some submerged rock that damaged its hull just below the waterline like what happened to the Titanic only without the iceberg. To keep the hull from flooding out, the crew began throwing any excess weight off of the ship and that included the possessions of the passengers it was carrying! Bessler complained that they threw all of his property off of the ship.

      If they found any of the passengers' money or jewelry while they were dumping any excess weight they would certainly have hung onto it. One of the crew members could have grabbed Bessler's notebook filled with pm machine drawings and, thinking it might be valuable, kept it. That would have been the book that was passed down through his family one generation after another until JEEB1717 managed to locate and purchase it.

      If his story is true then he literally has another MT and the only one in existence! What he has is not just a copy, but an original that Bessler would have carried with him and spent hours drawing sketches in. If it is signed with an authenticated Bessler signature than that would prove it is for real. It is similar to that copy of Leonardo da Vinci's "Codex Leicester" notebook that Bill Gates bought about 25 years ago for $30.8 MILLION USD! Of course, for him, that's just pocket change. But that notebook was only one of 50 different notebooks da Vinci filled up with his notes and sketches about different topics that interested him.

      In JEEB1717's case, he might have the ONLY notebook containing Bessler's early drawings in existence! God only knows how much something like that would sell for at an auction, yet he plans to just give it away to some library? At an auction, the bidding could START at maybe $50 million USD! What must it be like to hold a book in your hands that Bessler also held and carried with him around Europe? If I had something that, I would make photocopies of all of its pages and then lock it away in a major bank's safety deposit box. You know, the kind of bank where they keep those boxes inside a vault with a giant two foot thick steel door on it. Keeping such a rarity at one's home would be risky even if it was put into a safe there. I read of several cases where thieves broke into a someone's home, found a small safe, and then tore the safe out of the wall and made off with it! That then allowed them to take their time opening it later.

      I'm also looking forward to seeing what else from this alleged Bessler book of pm wheel drawings is revealed in the future by JEEB1717. So, please don't everyone scare him away by hurling insults and accusations of fraud at him. Let's see some more of those "early bikes" he claims to have before we decide whether or not to dismiss him as just another nut case passing through this blog.


      Anonymous and PROUD of it!

      Delete
    9. Danke STOLZER Bessler freund! Als ich familie fand, hatten sie das buch in einer kiste auf dem dachboden, das viele Jahre lang nicht geöffnet wurde. Als erfahren, dass ich das buch haben möchte, sagen sie, dass sie es fĂŒr 50.000 Euro an mich verkaufen. Ich sage, ich habe nicht so viel, aber ich gebe ihnen 20.000 Euro. Sie sagen sie nein und legen auf. Zwei wochen spĂ€ter rufen sie zurĂŒck und sagen, sie nehmen 20.000 Euro. Ich sage gut, aber zuerst möchte ich, dass mein experte es sich ansieht. Sie sagen, das ist gut.

      Ich komme mit das experte zu das haus. Er hat mich weitere 2.000 Euro gekostet. Er brachte laptop, scanner, chemikalien, ultraviolettes licht, und sogar ein mikroskop mit! Er nimmt das buch mit ins ein zimmer und verbringt ĂŒber vier stunden damit. Dann kommt er heraus und sagt zu mir, dass das buch zu 100% echt ist! Ich hatte einen scheck fĂŒr die 20.000 Euro fĂŒr das familie und sie gaben mir mein buch. Wir verabschieden uns alle und das wars.

      Ein freund, dem ich davon erzĂ€hlte, sagte, ich muss verrĂŒckt sein, weil ich so viel fĂŒr das buch bezahlt habe, aber ich glaube nicht. Jetzt wird es in zukunft fĂŒr alle in der bibliothek sei und nicht auf alte kiste auf dem dachboden und vielleicht eines tages weggeworfen zu werden. Ich denke, Bessler wĂ€re froh zu wissen, dass sein buch nicht verloren ging.

      Viele der zeichnungen sind unvollstĂ€ndig oder zeigen nur einige teile von maschinen. Aber ich werde die besten der buchzeichnungen fotokopieren und sie meinem freund geben, der sie zu computerbildern macht, die ich ins internet hochladen kann. Vielleicht habe ich im nĂ€chsten blog hier ein neues geschenk von Bessler fĂŒr euch.

      JEEB1717

      Delete
    10. Again, here's a quick google translation of JEEB1717's now third comment so far:

      "Thank you PROUD Bessler friend! When I found family, they had the book in a box in the attic that had not been opened for many years. When they found out that I wanted the book, they said they were going to sell it to me for 50,000 euros. I say I don't have that much, but I'll give them 20,000 euros. They say no and hang up. Two weeks later they call back and say they are taking 20,000 euros. I say good, but first I want my expert to look at it. They say that's good.

      I come to the house with the expert. It cost me another 2,000 euros. He brought a laptop, scanner, chemicals, ultraviolet light, and even a microscope! He takes the book into a room and spends over four hours with it. Then he comes out and tells me that the book is 100% real! I had a check for the 20,000 euros for the family and they gave me my book. We all say goodbye and that's it.

      A friend I told about this said I must be crazy for paying so much for the book, but I don't think so. Now in the future it will be in the library for everyone and not in an old box in the attic and maybe thrown away one day. I think Bessler would be happy to know that his book was not lost.

      Many of the drawings are incomplete or show only a few parts of machines. But I will photocopy the best of the book drawings and give them to my friend, who will turn them into computer images that I can upload to the internet. Maybe I'll have a new present from Bessler for you in the next blog.

      JEEB1717"

      Interesting and it's even starting to sound a little more believable.

      Delete
    11. @JEEB1717

      I'm sure most here will be eager and happy to see whatever you choose to share with us. Thank you for considering us worthy to view this new information!


      Anonymous and PROUD of it!

      Delete
  20. It needn't be the year 1705!!!

    It could be an image number from Besslerwheel.com...

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. A hoax, in my opinion, JEEB, Bessler’s initials, 1717 while at Kassel. This purports to be print, but he had no access to printing in 1705, and it won’t work anyway.

      JC

      Delete
  21. JEEB 1717 said "I can't draw, so my friend makes drawings for me."

    The wheel diagram is his friends drawing, from the alleged book signed by Bessler, not a Bessler print.

    I think it can't work either.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Of course it can't work because it's from 1705 and Bessler didn't have his breakthrough pm discovery until 1712 (or late 1711 if you believe Ken B). But if what JEEB1717 is showing us is based on genuine Bessler drawings, then they can give us another view of the kinds of approaches he was pursuing in his earliest days which may not be in MT. Also, btw, nothing that Bessler left in MT works either!

      Delete
  22. I am beginning to feel something fishy about JEEB 1717...

    Is it another form of Ken?...

    The language style, the blind support to it by Ken, etc., Is quite unmistakable...

    Having failed to achieve success first Ken introduced us to magnetic wheels and maybe this JEEB thing...

    Because, he is capable of such things...

    He is notorious for posting comments here under various guises...

    Our mission. Could be losing credibility fast...

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I don't think Ken has anything to do with JEEB1717 because its obvious that he is a German who has trouble with the English language. Also I don't think Ken would be promoting anything that took the attention off of his book and his interpretation of Bessler's wheels. I think that at this time we should give JEEB1717 a chance to show us what he has in case it's for real which it could be. I don't expect to see any runners in what he shows, but maybe it can give others here some new ideas to try with their own wheels.

      Delete
  23. New ideas to try?...

    That'll be an endless search... And, it could go on and on for another 300 years...

    Why he is not showing a picture of that book?... Why he is telling us he paid so much for it?...

    Actually, to achieve real success in this type of endeavour you have got to work it out from scratch... Not start off with someone's Idea which could be wrong and put us on a wrong course...

    This is what is happening with most...

    ReplyDelete
  24. What have you / we got to lose SK ? .. I'm sure that JEEB1717 will be thinking of posting some photo's of the booklet itself, the B. signature, and some of the more complete wheels, as he said, to verify its authenticity and his claims. Perhaps alongside his friends drawings of the same devices.

    If it is genuinely of B. origin I too don't expect it to show a runner combination. It would have been well before MT. Nevertheless if real it is of historical significance as he has said. It's been a while since any new information has come forward about the life and times of Bessler. And especially if it contains some of his earlier designs and concepts he was thinking about up to that point.

    Give JEEB1717 a chance to prove his assertions. If true he went to significant troubles and expense to procure it. He has not claimed the booklet contains a runner design so there is little chance of you being conned about anything ! He is not asking for money ! Just your good humour and indulgence.

    If he is a hoax that will become evident very quickly. The usual ploy is to feign indignation at being questioned, or slighted, and disappear. On the other hand he seems to be attempting to build trust.

    -f

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Sound advice fletch, and the extra information gives a more compelling picture of the book’s origin. I feel doubtful about the story of the sailor, in the same way that another account of a book supposedly passed down through his family to a some people the USA has never surfaced to date. But I will remain open minded until we have seen some pictures.

      I would happily do a blog on them with all due acknowledgements if that is the wish of JEEB1717

      JC

      Delete
    2. I'm inclined to agree with you. I'm 81 years old; I know bull sh*t when I see it---------------Sam

      Delete
  25. You see, this is one of the reasons why they call you f#&$*g lunatics, kranks, and kooks, and whatever else, here comes a person who says has original Bessler notebook, what he gets?
    He wants nothing of you, he might be more devoted Bessler researcher than all of you put together, including JC, sorry John, maybe he also wants to solve this mystery, and having a unique piece of Bessler’s drawings, which he wants to share with you lunatics, and what he gets? You call him fraud, hoax. Why don't you wait a bit and see what he has to offer. If he is a hoax, I'm sure you "experts" will be able see it, or "detect" it
    Now, a massage to JEEB 1717, don't show them anything, let them cook in their own soause for another 300+ years, they will not recognize PM if it was in front of their noseS. I do agree and share -f comments, at least one person sober and continues in this nest of lunatics. I'm very disappointed with the rest.

    Best regards

    BNR

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Instead of "continues" should be conscious

      Have fun

      BNR

      Delete
  26. Alright... Let's wait and watch... I agree with you guys... What actually intrigues me is someone, without any formal introduction, suddenly dropping a Bessler bomb... Another thing is that why he is not happy to reveal his to identity when he is in possession of a genuine thing?...
    Where was he all the while and why he chose our blog?...

    Why he is happy with ken and not address the blog owner?...

    It also makes it clear that he is not aware of the actual wheel design yet and hasn't even bought or gone through JC sir's Book which costs a fraction of what he paid that family...

    The sailor account maybe required for actually spicing up the story...

    All our scepticism is due to not showing a glimpse of the book and instead only an image being shown...

    What exactly is his intention?... How did JC sir miss this out when he biographed Bessler?...

    The image provided by him is totally an idea one encounters in the initial phase of Bessler research and far, far away from the truth...

    We are being taken back to basics...

    This is an indication that the actual secret is not known to us and that we easily fall for such images...

    The reality is we are more advanced now than anytime before...

    The 141 drawings actually are superior to what is being shown to us by him... I can say with confidence that the real secret is scattered among the 141 drawings... If one looks keenly it possible to spot it.

    First 50,000 euros then finally 20,000 euros...

    That's hell a lot of money...

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    Replies
    1. "Why he is happy with ken and not address the blog owner?..."

      Maybe it has something to do with the blog owner starting off by immediately calling him a hoaxer based on only a single image he linked to?

      "First 50,000 euros then finally 20,000 euros...That's hell a lot of money..."

      Centuries old rare books in almost any condition often sell for tens of thousands of Euro's at auctions. Considering that the family reduced their initial asking price by 60%, I think JEEB1717 got a very good price for the item considering it's one of a kind. They must have been very desperate for money and a quick sale which JEEB1717 was willing to provide them at a lower and more affordable price for him. If he ever changes his mind and decides to auction off the book, he will probably make back several times the 22,000 Euro's he paid to get it.

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  27. Everyone here seems to think that JEEB1717 has some great need to prove that he does, in fact, have a genuine and previously unknown work by Bessler. If he's had the work verified by a expert in literature forensics, then he could probably care less about what anyone here thinks. For all we know, that expert could have been referred to him by that rare book library he mentioned that will inherit the book and, after his examination, they have also accepted it a genuine. Possibly, he's already shown them the book.

    Why not post photos of the book and give his identity? Simple, if you had a rare item worth tens maybe hundreds of millions of dollars, would you actually give your identity and photos of the work online? You would be inviting every criminal and psycho out there to drop in on you to steal the work, kidnap you or family members to hold for ransoms, or even try to make fake copies of it to use to scam investors. I think JEEB1717 wants to remain totally anonymous until after he dies and the book is transferred to that rare book library.

    Why is he showing us images based on some of the drawings in the book? He could have been following this blog for years and appreciates that many here have a sincere interest in all things related to Bessler. So, he has decided to give us a little preview of what he has instead of just sitting on it until he dies by which time several of the older members here could also be gone. It's really nice of him to do something like that.

    We have a rare opportunity here and I hope we don't blow it by pressing him to reveal information that he might not feel comfortable revealing at this time. Something tells me we are going to be really amazed by what he shows us in the future. We need to just relax a little and be patient.

    Apparently, he has to have the drawings from his book separately redrawn by a friend. Also, we don't know what the condition of those drawings is. Don't assume they are all in ink. If Bessler was just making quick sketches, he could have been using pencil. Pencil drawings can undergo a lot of fading over time, especially after centuries have passed. His friend might have to use special software to enhance the pencil drawings enough so he can then make image files from them.


    Anonymous and PROUD of it!

    ReplyDelete
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    1. Nochmals vielen dank, mein STOLZER Bessler freund!

      Ich kann Ihnen noch ein paar details zu meinem buch geben. Es ist ungefĂ€hr 20 zentimeter breit und ungefĂ€hr 25 zentimeter hoch. Es enthĂ€lt 78 seiten, die fĂŒr die zeichnungen nicht liniert sind. Es fehlen keine seiten und 63 davon sind mit zeichnungen versehen. Er hat auf jede seite mehrere zeichnungen geklebt, als wollte er das papier nicht verschwenden! Es ist etwas mit tinte geschrieben, aber das meiste sind skizzen verschiedener mechanismen mit bleistift, die ein wenig verschmiert und verblasst sind. Vorder und rĂŒckseite des buches sind steif und mit einer art tierhaut ĂŒberzogen. Der rĂŒcken ist aufgebrochen und man sieht die schnĂŒre des einbandes im Inneren.

      Mein buchexperte sagt, ich könnte es reparieren lassen, aber das wĂŒrde weitere 1.000 Euro kosten, die ich mir nicht leisten kann. Die leute in der bibliothek fĂŒr seltene bĂŒcher sagen, dass sie es vorziehen, dass ich das buch in keiner weise Ă€ndere. Sie werden alle notwendigen reparaturen durchfĂŒhren.

      Auf einer der titelseiten befindet sich eine sehr deutliche tintensignatur von Elias Bessler. Ich werde darĂŒber nachdenken, ein foto hochzuladen, das ich davon habe. Ich möchte nicht, dass es von fĂ€lschern verwendet wird, um fĂ€lschungen zu machen, um geld von leuten zu stehlen. Heutzutage kann man nicht vorsichtig genug sein.

      JEEB1717

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    2. Here's another quick google translation of JEEB1717's now fourth comment here:

      "Thank you again, my PROUD Bessler friend!

      I can give you a few more details about my book. It is about 20 inches wide and about 25 inches high. It contains 78 pages that are not lined for the drawings. There are no missing pages and 63 of them are provided with drawings. He stuck several drawings on each side as if he didn't want to waste the paper! There is something written in ink, but most of it is pencil sketch of various mechanisms that are a little smeared and faded. The front and back of the book are stiff and covered with a kind of animal skin. The back is broken open and you can see the cords of the binding inside.

      My book expert says I could get it fixed, but that would cost another $ 1,000 that I can't afford. The folks at the rare book library say they prefer me not to change the book in any way. They will do any necessary repairs.

      On one of the front pages there is a very clear ink signature from Elias Bessler. I will think about uploading a photo I have of it. I don't want it to be used by counterfeiters to make fakes to steal money from people. You can't be too careful these days.

      JEEB1717"

      Looks like there's another translator error here. JEEB1717 says in his German comment that the book measured 20 centimeters wide and 25 centimeters high and not 20 inches wide and 25 inches high! Converting the centimeters to inches means his book is about 8 inches wide x 10 inches high. I guess this is a good size for a book to put sketches into. The "back" of the book that is broken open probably refers to the book's spine that covers the binding and is damaged.

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    3. Maybe he should sign it, "KBBS2021----------------------Sam

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    4. The description of JEEB1717's Bessler drawing book sounds real to me. Bessler was probably the type who had ideas faster than he could build them and he needed a way to record them quickly. Pencil sketches are ideal for that. I would also like to see that photo of the Bessler signature he says his book expert authenticated. If he was signing his name "Elias Bessler" that means he had this book with him before he added the "Johann Ernst" to the name his parents gave him. I've always wondered why he added those two names.

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    5. Does anyone know what year Bessler added the Johann and Ernst names to Elias Bessler?

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  28. The image pertains to the year 1705 or 1717 as per JEEB 1717...and he mentions they are early bikes...

    But, in fact, bicycle was invented 100 years later...

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Let me just point out that on-line translations usually translate ‘rad’ as bike instead of wheel.

      BNR, I followed up my early reaction with a more open minded one, and offered to post any of the drawings here with all due acknowledgements.

      I bought an original version of DT a few years ago from a well-known second hand book seller in Karlshafen for about £1500, which is about €1780 euros. My version has a full history and was owned by a famous opera singer for many years. It contained Bessler’s signature and corrections to the text. I thing €20,000 is a lot but if you can afford it then I’m pleased for you.

      I don’t know why JEEB1717 could not simply photograph one or two pages with his mobile and send them to someone to list here, or elsewhere. It would be useful to see his signature which was verified by an expert. How did he sign it, Bessler or Orffyreus etc. So many questions and so little information.

      JC

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    2. ‘ The modern pencil was invented in 1795 by Nicholas-Jacques Conte, a scientist serving in the army of Napoleon Bonaparte. The magic material that was so appropriate for the purpose was the form of pure carbon that we call graphite. ‘ (https://www.brainpickings.org/2013/06/24/history-of-the-pencil/)

      Bessler might have had access to graphite stick, but they were expensive and rare. The original pencil referred to a small paint brush. Bessler could have used a quill and ink.

      JC

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    3. I found this online:

      "Nuremberg, Germany was the birthplace of the first mass-produced pencils in 1662."

      Apparently these consisted of a pure graphite rod that was inserted into a wood tube. They were popular with artists by the early 18th century and Bessler could have used them for quick sketches when traveling and carrying ink and quill pens with him was inconvenient not to mention messy.

      I also found this:

      "In 1794, Revolutionary France was at war with Britain and completely cut off from high-quality English graphite. The minister of war asked engineer Nicolas-Jacques Conté to find a solution. Conté ground up impure, low-quality graphite, mixed it with wet clay, shaped the mixture into rods and then baked them. The result: passable pencil lead."

      Bessler would have been using the best type of pencil which is one made with pure graphite and not made using some cheap blend of graphite and clay. No wonder Napoleon failed to conquer the world...he was using cheaply made pencils! Lol!

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The True Story of Bessler’s Perpetual Motion Machine - Update

At the end of March we sold our house and moved in with my daughter, son-in-law and granddaughter, expecting to be there for no more than tw...